A Long Time Mystery

[Dick Welty]

I purchased this small hopper cooled Hit and Miss engine in about 1984 from Carl Bergman who lived in Lancaster California. He told me that an old timer in the Lancaster area had told him that the engine had been used to turn a honey separator. Now Carl must have been about 70 at the time so this old timer must have been older than dirt.

When I bought the engine it was missing almost all of the governor and timing parts as well as the external flywheel and pulley. The crank is cantilevered inside the crank case and it has a brass connecting rod and cap. There are two sets of roller bearings supporting the crank one against the internal flywheel and the other near the external flywheel and pulley. The bore is about 2" and I imagine this engine puts out about 1/2 to 3/4 hp.

The engine as I bought it consisted of the complete internals, the push rod and exhaust valve rocker arm and the brass mixer with a crude gas tank soldered on top. The green parts in the pictures excluding the parts at the base of the front foot are the original parts. The push rod and bracket are original but the governor lockout arm, spring and catch were reverse engineered by me to make the engine run. It runs well and fires about 20 times a minute at 350 rpm at idle. The flywheel that I installed is a water valve turn off wheel bushed and keyed to fit the crankshaft.

The oiler on top of the crankcase drops oil onto the crank lubricating the conecting rod bearing and splashing oil onto the wristpin and piston. There is an overflow vent near the bottom of the crankcase shown in the rear view of the engine that drips oil into a catchcup mounted on the bottom of the cart. This vent is high enough to allow the build up of oil in the crankcase to be slung by the internal flywheel onto the piston to further lubricate it. The roller bearings are lubricated by the grease cup mounted on the top of the crankshaft housing nest to the crankcase.

It has been suggested that this engine was a pump conversion or a shop project. I doubt that it is either as it has a water jacket and the cylinder head crankcase and water hopper castings are of a sophisticated thim wall design and are high quality. I find it hard to believe that someone would go to that much trouble to make the casting tools necessary to cast this engine if it were just a one up project or a prototype.

I was showing the engine at the Orange County Fair in California about 18 years ago when a man said that his Uncle had a Nordyke and Marmon Flourmill engine somewhat larger but similar in appearance. I have since found that that company was in Indianapolis Indiana and sold out to Allis Chalmers prior to 1928. I have no way of knowing if this man knew what he was talking about or was just blowing smoke.

Any help in identifying this engine will be appreciated.

Dick

[Kevin O. Pulver]

Sorry I don't have any help for you, but it's a neat little engine. Keep showing it and posting it here and one day maybe you'll find the information you want. Kevin

[Dick Welty]

I just thought I might try again to solve this Mystery.

Please help me shed some light on this engine if you can.

Thanks,

[Jebaroni]

Does it run? I'll give ya $150 fer it!

Really cool little engine. Sorta reminds me of a two-cylinder Edwards for some reason.

Jeb

[Eric M.]

Just ran into this one. I have seen the pictures of this engine before, through the gallery pictures at the top of the main page, but I never knew it was a fairly local engine! Very interesting! Maybe someone knows more?

[R. Kern]

Have you tried to do any research at the Vista museum? Might either take it to one of the shows in June or October or take some pictures with you when you go to the show at Vista and show them around...someone might just know...Interesting little engine

[loggerhogger]

it almost looks like it could be a fairmont (or something similar) railroad speeder engine.

[IronCity2006]

Chances of you ever really finding the make may be very slim. At the time when these engines were being made alot of small and large machine shops, blacksmiths, inventors and folks in there own homes were building gas engines. I presume there may have been few hundered differnt makers that we will never know much about. Some may have built just one, others may have made 50. At this time you could make a set of patterns and have a local foundry cast them so their is one thing to keep in mind. Unlike today they worked with anybody and everybody to stay in busness. So who knows really!

[Daniel Dorece]

I have seen pictures of this little engine a couple of times before and I keep thinking that I have seen the cylinder-crankcase casting somewhere before but I can't recall where and that is the reason I haven't replied before. I keep hoping I will remember where or see it again. I really think that it was not an engine originally. The hopper almost looks like a muffler casting and the valve train and ignition system could all be home made but then what do I know? Even if it is a home built it is a very nice little engine and it has fooled all us "experts" for a long time. If I ever do see the Cylinder-crankcase again I will contact you.

Iron Wolf

[Eric M.]

I agree Dan, certain features look extremely familiar.
It's really frustrating. The thing that really gets me is that is has a roller bearing crank, an enclosed crankcase, and thin-wall castings. It even looks like there is a packing gland on the outside of the crankcase acting as a crank seal. To me that says whoever made it knew what they were doing.

[Tilinghast]

Reminds me a little bit of a water pump I've seen some where.