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fairbanks morse 3hp Z


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  #1  
Old 02-16-2005, 10:32:56 PM
Jim Scott
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Default fairbanks morse 3hp Z

starting my next project,thought i had the correct book,guess not! the 3hp z i have looks like the one on page 165 in wendels book.where do i get the model designation of this engine? is it a c?where can a guy get this information?my manual is for model ZA.i can see it is not right.my brass tag says sn:176224 3hp.450rpm.i need the correct manual. thanks jim scott
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  #2  
Old 02-17-2005, 09:16:07 AM
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David M. Lyon David M. Lyon is offline
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

The serial number you give makes it a 1916 year model, and it should be an ignitor fired engine with a single piece cylinder & water hopper, open crank,and a large oval brass tag with the serial number stamped into the tag...Nice find!...Call Ed Dies at Hit & Miss enterprises (1 440 272 5335)...He will ask you some questions and get you the correct manual...He also has SOME reproduction parts for this model....I like those Fairbanks-Morse engines!

David M.
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  #3  
Old 02-17-2005, 12:28:37 PM
Ken Adamson Ken Adamson is offline
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

Jim,
How interesting, I have an identical engine in my shop that I have been tinkering with part time for the last year. Just this morning, before heading to work, I was out in the shop and decided to attempt to unstick the throttle butterfly valve again. The head has been in the vice for some time, while trying to get the valve unstuck and this morning it finally broke loose. One happy day!!
Keep me posted on your progress.
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Old 02-17-2005, 01:25:54 PM
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Tom Winland Tom Winland is offline
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Photo Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

Probably similar to this 3HP Fairbanks that I'm restoring right now that is on a pumpjack made to pump oil.

Tom Winland
Ohio
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MVC-242a.jpg   MVC-243a.jpg   MVC-244a.jpg  
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Old 02-17-2005, 02:31:22 PM
Ken Adamson Ken Adamson is offline
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Photo Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

Tom,
I can’t speak for Jim or his engine, but actually the engine in your pictures is a newer engine/model than mine. I believe FM started that model in about 1920? My 1924 looks like the one in your pictures, the 1916 looks like the one below, sorry, can’t remember the name of the model at the moment, having one of those CRS days.
Ken
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fm3z1916.jpg  
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  #6  
Old 02-17-2005, 03:09:50 PM
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

The first type "Z" engines were ignitor fired with a low tension rotary mag until about 1918, then they used high tension and an AB33 Bosch magneto.. In the early twenties, Fairbanks Morse started building their OWN rotary magnetos, starting with the type "R" then the "RV1" and later the type "J" and changed the water hopper to two piece so they could mount different types of cooling apparatus, such as tank coolers or condenser coolers. I think they called these engines type "ZB" ...Somewhere around 1930 they came out with the closed crank type "ZC" engine and continued with the base mount type "J" mag...Not sure when the designation of "ZA" engines came along ...Most likely with the bosch mag...Need to research that!

David M.
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Old 02-17-2005, 05:39:00 PM
Jim Scott
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

well guys it does not look exactly like either one of the pictures posted. it does have an ignitor and the mag looks like it is mounted on the ignitor itself. is there a way to test the ignitor mag setup?it has great compression and if it has fire i think it will run. thanks jim scott
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Old 02-17-2005, 05:46:32 PM
Lonnie Shinn Lonnie Shinn is offline
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

Is this 3 hp in question hopper cooled or tank cooled???
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Old 02-17-2005, 06:00:57 PM
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

sounds like a plugosilator engine with sumter mag.

Tom Winland
Ohio
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Old 02-17-2005, 06:16:39 PM
Ken Adamson Ken Adamson is offline
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

Now I'm really curious too.
Is it like one of the ones below?
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sumter.jpg   Sumterplugoscillator.jpg   Boschmag1.jpg  
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  #11  
Old 02-17-2005, 06:21:13 PM
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David M. Lyon David M. Lyon is offline
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Scott
well guys it does not look exactly like either one of the pictures posted. it does have an ignitor and the mag looks like it is mounted on the ignitor itself. is there a way to test the ignitor mag setup?it has great compression and if it has fire i think it will run. thanks jim scott
Fairbanks Morse called that a "plugoscilator" and was an option to the rotary low tension mag...Just trip it with a screwdriver and see if there is any fire at the points.
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  #12  
Old 02-17-2005, 06:25:06 PM
Jim Scott
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

this engine is hopper cooled, jim
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  #13  
Old 02-17-2005, 06:27:38 PM
Jim Scott
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

it does not look like any of these pictures.
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  #14  
Old 02-17-2005, 06:49:58 PM
Jim Scott
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

went back out and it does look like the picture in the middle.
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Old 02-17-2005, 06:54:11 PM
BobRR BobRR is offline
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

Jim 1916 the fairbanks came with the rotary sumpter mag like the left pict.that ken has posted. in 1918 they changed over to the plug oscalotor.center pict. If it doesnt look like one those can you post a pict?
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Old 02-17-2005, 07:03:21 PM
Jim Scott
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

i cant post pictures,it does look like the center picture,but there is no band around the mag and no holes for one.there is a single wire from the outside of the mag to a post on the same bracket for the mag. the springs are between the mag and the water hopper and the trip mech. is there also.
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Old 02-17-2005, 07:31:22 PM
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

if it is the plugosilator there is a finger on the bracket that if you have the bracket off the engine you can trip the mag with that finger and see if it sparks at the points, I had a couple of those engines over the years.

Tom Winland
Ohio
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  #18  
Old 02-17-2005, 09:54:43 PM
Jim Scott
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

i took the bracket off and when i trip the points open there is no spark. does it need to be grounded while doing this?
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Old 02-17-2005, 10:10:54 PM
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

As long as the mag is bolted to the bracket it is grounded and the wire is connected to the ignitor you should get spark depending if you trip it far enough, you may also need to clean the points up and charge the magnets on the mag.

Tom Winland
Ohio
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Old 02-18-2005, 12:25:28 AM
Jonathan Widelo Jonathan Widelo is offline
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Default Re: fairbanks morse 3hp Z

I have a 1919 Fairbanks Morse 3 hp throttle governed engine the cam gov bracket only has oil holes no grease cups there are only 3 cups on the engine 2 on the mains and one on the crank , like an earlier engine such as the 1 1/2 headless. I am assuming that my engine is one of the early style of this bosch equipped engine I have read that the AB-33 Magneto was first used in 1919. the designation "ZA" refers to a bosch equipped Fairbanks engine.
~ Jonathan
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