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Antique Gas Engine Discussion

Cleaning water hopper and Name tags


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  #1  
Old 06-21-2005, 01:04:46 PM
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Jebaroni Jebaroni is offline
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Question Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

Hey guys; How do you go about cleaning out your water hoppers? Mine looks as if someone tried to line it with something in the past and I have big chunks of what looks like clay and sediment coming off of the inside of the hopper. I could sandblast the bottom areas but how do you clean off the sides that are close to the top and the underside of the top?

Also, I'm thinking of removing my name tag so that I can clean under there, paint under there and possibly replace the tag itself. What is your preferred method for removal? Grind the drive screws off? Pry them out gently? I will probably try to flatten and straighten out the original tag as the edges are all sorta curling up, but who makes repro tags and how much? Doesn't Bill Lopolou have some repro tags? This is for my Taylor Vacuum engine and I have not found anybody reproducing them yet, so I would have to send mine out to have a new one made. Any ideas on who to send it to (I heard that bill was really backed up, otherwise i'd send it to him). Also, I know there is a sort of Do it yourself kit out there but I'd rather put my time and effort into other parts of the engine and just outsource the tag to somebody else.

Jeb
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Old 06-21-2005, 01:22:41 PM
DanR
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Default Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

Bet you've got mud dobbers. The old nests come apart in chunks like clay but don't seem to be water soluable. I used a pressure washer and in about an hour the hopper was clean, crud and all. Had to keep cleaning out the drain.
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Old 06-21-2005, 01:38:54 PM
Peter Peter is offline
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Default Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

I am not familar with this engine, but if you are talking about a tag with the makers name, engine size and SERIAL NUMBER. I would never in my wildest halucination replace that with a repro. If thats what were are talking about. Twice in as meany years, I have lucked into a rare variation or early engine and in both case I had several engine guys closely scrutinize the name plates. I was not selling, nor were they questing my honesty. But; wondering if someone was playing games in the past. Well, I was darn lucky I did not mess with those tags or do any extreme restoration work. The serial number is pretty what makes your engine what it is, beyond a collection of parts. Then again, some makers did not apply serial numbers. In this special case if the tag is badly damaged, I would try and remove it and straighten it out. I would defiantely reuse it. I dont like the way cast iron looks after sand blasting. Maybe you can scrap it with the end of a file or putty knife. For stubborn removal, You can also put a nice 90 degree edge on a file using a grinder. My 2c.
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Old 06-21-2005, 01:48:17 PM
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Default Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

I may do as you suggest and remove the tag for straightening and reinstall. The serial number on the tag matches the serial number stamped on a boss on the side of the engine. And i'm refering to cleaning the INSIDE of the hopper. No WAY to get in there with a file or wire wheel or anything. It is much more dense than mud dauber stuff (have those underneath where the fuel tank goes) and is about a 1/8" thick even coating over the entire inside of the hopper. I was wondering about using like Muriatic acid or something like that to clean it up in there. There is also old grease and filth up underneath the top of the hopper on the inside that I would like to get out as well.

On a side note, what sort of paint do you guys use to paint your engines? How do you keep oil and grease from lifing the paint? I painted my tractor with a single stage Urethane paint but gasoline lifts it very quickly and it stains. Would I have to go to a base coat/clear coat system to keep everything "sealed"? Just curious.
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Old 06-21-2005, 02:31:42 PM
Joe Morris Joe Morris is offline
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Default Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

Jabaroni, Removing the tag can sometimes be easy to do by feeling on the inside of the hopper under the tag. The rivets that hold them in most cases protrude through the hopper, I have removed several through the years by useing the equivalent of a hammer head. Usually no room for a handle of a hammer. Soak the rivets a while, then reach inside and tap them and with luck they will pop up. hope this helps a little Joe Morris
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Old 06-21-2005, 02:36:45 PM
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Default Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

I use electrolysis to clean the hoppers. It will take it down to clean metal with no effort!
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Old 06-21-2005, 03:04:50 PM
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Default Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

I am using electrolysis to clean the block. I'm just not sure how to get an electrode down in there to clean out the hopper It's a very awkward spot to try and clean but you are correct in that it is probably the easiest method (and gentlest) to clean the inside of the hopper. How do you set it up? do you fill the hopper with water and plug the drain (outside of the engine is dry), or do you submerge the whole block and do everything at once? How do you make your electrode?

Jeb
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Old 06-21-2005, 03:14:47 PM
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Elden DuRand Elden DuRand is offline
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Default Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jebaroni
I am using electrolysis to clean the block. I'm just not sure how to get an electrode down in there to clean out the hopper It's a very awkward spot to try and clean but you are correct in that it is probably the easiest method (and gentlest) to clean the inside of the hopper. How do you set it up? do you fill the hopper with water and plug the drain (outside of the engine is dry), or do you submerge the whole block and do everything at once? How do you make your electrode?

Jeb
Jeb:

To get the lime-like deposits out, you can go to your local hardware store and get a gallon of muriatic acid. That'll cut the calcium. Just assemble enough 'til it's water tight and fill pour in the acid.

Be careful! Doo this out of doors because of the chlorine gas that will be given off. Also, it might boil so be aware. Once it's settled down, add enough water to fill the hopper and walk away for a day or so.

That should do the trick.

Take care - Elden
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Old 06-21-2005, 03:38:58 PM
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Default Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

DANG Eldon; i'm so jealous of you. You have TWO engines i've been wanting for a long time, the Aermotor and the Edwards. Someday....someday!
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Old 06-22-2005, 01:19:11 AM
Jim McCracken Jim McCracken is offline
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Smile Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

I personally would remove an original tag only in very extreme cases .
I read somewhere about a tool a collector made to pull the rivets in one such case.He took a thin putty knife and using a Dremel grinder and cut-off wheel
cut a 1/8 wide slot in the center of the leading edge.This would extend in about 3/16 .He would drive this under the tag and pry the rivet out,"Hopefully".
Concerning the water hopper cleaning,The acid should clean it out ok.
We were always reminded when mixing strong acid and water to follow the alphabet
and add acid to water not vice virsa.Good Luck and Play Safe !
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Old 06-22-2005, 04:19:43 AM
BWegher BWegher is offline
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Default Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

Sludge in the hopper can be dissolved with liquid drain cleaner.
Wear plastic gloves and a plastic face shield.
Mix a quart of industrial drain cleaner with a gallon of hot water, but not boiling, in a plastic bucket. Pour into the hopper and wait an hour, use a plastic toilet bowl brush to stir every few minutes.
Careful when draining, this stuff will completely clean the hopper and not hurt the metal.
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Old 06-22-2005, 06:42:09 AM
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Default Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

When I use the electrolysis in the tank, I will seal up any openings with plastic and duct tape. Fill only the inside withe water and a little baking soda. I make the electrodes out of old coffee cans, paint cans, etc. You can bend them to fit around corners, etc... I will put an insulating layer of duct tap around the outside of the tin to prevent it from shorting out in tight places.
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Old 06-22-2005, 09:53:36 AM
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Default Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

RE: the paint, I started with Dupont Centari for the first two engines and now am using a little less expensive Dupont Nason. Both are bulletproof to petroleum products and am very pleased with it.

RE: Electrolysis, I use Arm and Hammer "Washing Soda," and one has to be inventive as to where the electrodes go.

Tri-Sodium Phosphate (TSP) was a good cleaner, but now I understand that the phosphate has been removed. Check with a house paint store and see if they have the good old stuff.

Hope this helped some.
RickinMt.
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Old 06-22-2005, 10:07:02 AM
Jonathan Widelo Jonathan Widelo is offline
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Default Re: Cleaning water hopper and Name tags

I found the best way to clean heavy hopper grease is to plug any drain opening and pour strait undiluted oil eater in to the hopper and let it sit for a couple of days in one case, since this is a project engine i let it sit a week, i did this twice for my 1918 Fairbanks Morse Headless Block the amount of grease in the hopper was amazing how thick it was, this way worked good and you don't have to worry about using acids or harsh chemicals, I bought this stuff at Costco, it came in a large detergent sized bottle
just some thoughts
~Jonathan
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