Continental engines

[John Magarey]

Does any body know what vehicles had Continental S4 engines fitted to them? I am very keen to find this model engine to restore our 1927 Fisher Fast Freight truck? The engine was a 4 cylinder 250 cubic inch side valve motor.Thanks for your help, John Magarey

[Bud Tierney]

Well, FWIW, here's a start...kinda...The problem is: in my 29 or 30 McCord gasket catalog it lumps S4 with S10, both apparently 41/4x41/2 4"s taking the same gaskets...this catalog lists:
Acme: 24,44,54,340, 11/4-21/2T;
Acorn: 20,30,40,45, 11/2-21/2T;
Brockway: 1-2T;
Beck: A, 11/4-2T;
Clydesdale: 9,10A,16, 1, 11/4-2T;
Commerce S10, SO11, 11/2-2T;
Corbitt: 25,40, 11/2-2T;
Defiance: E2, 21/2T; , 11/2-2T;
Dixon: (no models listed);
Fisher: FF,ME, 11/2-2T;
Gramm-Bernstein: 125, 21/2T;
Huffman: BC, 2T;
King Zeitler: 35, 45, 11/2-21/2T;
Kleiber: AA, 1T;
Krebs: 34,44, 13/4-3T;
Le Moon: (no models);
Selden: Pacemaker, 11/4T; Unit, 2T;
Traffic: 2-5T;
Traylor: (no models);
Witt-Will: NN,P, 11/2-2T
Allis-Chalmers Tractor (no model).
Unfortunately, no years are shown. Mine is the smaller catalog (308 pgs); someone here has the master catalog, much bigger and more complete. I'll eyeball some of my later catalogs to see if I can find anything else. Good luck.

[John Magarey]

Hi Bud, Thanks very much for the information. As you suggested the S4 is a 4 1/4 by 4 1/2 engine. Regards John M

[Bud Tierney]

Well, hold your hat; going into these parts catalogs is like falling down Alice's rabbit hole...in the following, (J) is a valve catalog and (A) is a piston catalog, BOTH OF WHICH ARE DATED 29, WHICH MAY OMIT SOME 29 USES, AND THERE ARE PROBABLY USES LATER THAN 29... SO: ADD THE FOLLOWING:
Acme: 14,16,41, 1927-29 (J), 21 (no yrs) (A);
Acorn: neither listed;
Beck: A for 1925-28 (A);
Brockway: neither listed a Cont S4;
Clydesdale: 9, 16 only for 1926-27 (J); catalog (A) showed these three models (no years)with a Cont B7 (!!) (not really that unusual, sadly);
Commerce:Super 11 , S(Super?)14 1925-28 (J); SD11 instead of S011 (no yrs) (A);
Corbitt: nothing new;
Defiance H, no yrs (A);
Dixon: Mod D, 1926 (J); DS4,1926 (A);
Fisher: nothing new;
Grm-Bnstein: 125, 1927-29 (J);
Huffman: nothing new;
King-Ztlr: 25,30,40,45 1926-29 (J);
Kleiber: only showed AA for 1920-21 with Cont C4, no S4 shown (J);
Krebs: nothing new;
Le Moon: nothing new;
NELSON LE MOON: GP 1925-26 (J); same 1925-27 (A);
REPUBLIC: 15, 1928 (J);
Selden: Pacemaker 35 (that's one model) 1926-29, no "Unit"(A); Pavemaker 1929,no "Unit" (A);
Traffic: 4000C,6000 1925-28, (J);
Traylor: nothing new;
Witt-Will: same models, 1927-29 (J);
Allis-C: nothing new.
COMPLICATION??? the J catalog showed all except Republic and Witt-Will as a 6cyl, but I find no S4 6cyl in the McCord catalog, which lists the S4 as a 4cyl, so it's probably a misprint(s). (also not unusual) (??)
My sources are weak on the 29-35 period; lots of listings but little engine ID.
A bearing catalog shows three separate numbers for the three mains caps, and no insert number, so probably all poured bearings. Have fun!! Bud

[John Magarey]

Dear Bud, Thanks very much for your interest in my concerns. It seems that quite a few vehicles had Continental S4 motors but they don't seem to be very common in Australia. I have rung quite a lot of old truck folk around the country and it seems I have a few leeds that seem hopeful. You have given me a broader base to work from and this may be of considerable help as people usually remember the make of the vehicle that may be sitting under some gum tree and not the make of the engine. Thanks again for your help, Regards John Magarey

[KidDynamo]

Kaiser used 'em. So did some Auburn and Reo's.

[KidDynamo]

OOps, I didn't read the ?? I listed some that were 6 cyclinder engines, models unknown.

[John Schwiebert]

John: Can not help you with any parts as far as I know, But there is a restored truck near here that according to Bud's list should have that engine, if pictures will help any, but it will be a minimum of 2 weeks before I can check into that.

[Bud Tierney]

John: Sheesh!! Would you believe I never noticed where you were located?? (and what's worse, never tumbled to "fitted"!!).
I ran the last couple months postings on Tomm.com.au, a smallish site there I try to keep track of (not very well, I'm afraid), and didn't see a post by you; is there some reason you haven't tried them? I don't know that much about Continental history, but I'd be surprised if they didn't export engines.
Most of our trucks of that period were "assembled"--the company usually made or bought the frame and bodywork, and then fitted (see: it's contagious) the mechanical gear from various other m'f'r's. If the same was true there, there may be Au trucks that used this engine, and only be known to old-timers or show up, like my list, in parts catalogs that show makes, models AND what engine usually came with it. Parts catalogs are notoriously incomplete, and tend to cover the more popular models (why carry parts that don't sell?) ( mine don't seem to include any Brit or foriegn makes) so there may well be others, and possibly some Au's.
There's a nice little thumnail history in Mroz's US truck book, still available at good prices; Georgano's world-wide truck book is getting around $50 US.
If there's another Au site similar to this or Tomm.com au, would you advise? (my curiousity always exceeds my time).
Oh...one more thing...if it's not socially unacceptable to ask...why do they call it Oz?? With sympathy, Bud

[John Magarey]

Hi Bud, Thanks for your suggestions. I have advertised in the TOMM magazine a while ago and didn't get a response but I think you have to keep on putting things in front of folk in hope that some one will see your request who has the parts you need. I had a look at the TOMM site tonight and I will put a request in there. I have rung quite alot of old truck clubs and come across a lot of interesting folk who are have interesting stories to tell and who will enquire on my behalf. Some one said that if you have an interest you will have friends and there is a lot of truth in that.
At this stage I don't know of any other significant web site for old gear in Australia but there may well be others out there. The Smokstak web site is a credit to those that set it up and to those who maintain it. As far as where did the "Oz" come from, I think it came from "Aussie" (as in Australian) and as we don't like wasting ink it seem the best slang term to use. My brother came across another dismantled Fisher truck the other day that is in a farming area near the mouth of the River Murray in South Australia. The vehicle is not for sale and has a poor engine but it would be good to check the chassis measurements as we have got two chassis rails folded up to rebuild ours.Thanks again for your help, Regards from John M

[John Magarey]

Hi John, Thanks very much for your offer to get some pictures of a Continental engine. I have seen some pictures of the Fisher truck that the Hayes truck museum in Sacremento had and it would be quite helpful to get some others to show folk to help them identify an engine if they thought they had the correct one. The engine from our truck was sold probably 60 years ago to a friend of my grandfather's and I have never seen the engine in the flesh. Thanks again for you offer, Regards John M

[John Hanson]

John,
You might try asking over on www.aths.org on the discussion page...seems to me that some of the guys over there have some Continental engined trucks.
JH

[John Schwiebert]

Come on guys: They also made larger engines and diesel engines as well. They were the standard power in the old Army 5 ton trucks. Six cylinder overhead valve Your older M-H diesel tractors as well as a few others used the Continental diesels. At work about 10 years ago we did one out of a World War 1 era car.

[John Magarey]

Thanks for your interest Kevin. The engine we are after is a 1927 model and although the engine on ebay looks quite similar it is a fair bit younger and more modern looking than ours. John M

[Bud Tierney]

For those out there who haven't achieved a certain age, John S is speaking from experience re' Continental etc engines in cars. Just like a lot of the 'teens and 20's trucks were "assembled" (stock mech gear) so were a lot of that periods cars. I had at one time some old Lycoming ads with lists of the cars that used Lycomings. Cont's were also very popular in cars, along with a few Rutenbur, Hershell-Spillman, Falls, Hinkley and other long-gone names. Wauk and Buda I'm not sure about, but then I've never really looked that much (30's was more my interest then, and by the 30's almost all the "assembled" cars had died before or during the crash). In one of these threads we found that Graham used Cont engines, except they fitted their own cyl head and assessories, etc. Small world.