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Antique Tractors - Old Iron Lugs, Cleats and Tracks Photos and information about antique steel wheeled farm tractors. This is where to find the heaviest of Old Iron.

Antique Tractors - Old Iron Lugs, Cleats and Tracks

Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering


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  #1  
Old 11-14-2007, 11:19 PM
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Default Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Here is a picture of one of a set of 8+ WD-40 McCormick Deering tractors I recently brought back to the states from Canada. I know it's not on steel but it SHOULD be and will be again so I posted it here. It's certainly from the late steel wheeled era but Craig can move it if he thinks it's more appropriate elsewhere

The tractor runs and was built in 1935 during the first few months of production. While it has the 45 degree cylinder head field improvement package, I don't believe the tractor has ever been repainted since new. It's kind of nice to find one like this once in a while.
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Last edited by Eric Best; 11-14-2007 at 11:27 PM.
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Old 11-15-2007, 12:53 AM
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Hi Eric. thats a good looking original. where abouts in Canada did it come from? Your rad must have been changed sometime because if its an early 35 it would have McCormick Deering cast into it rather than the alum. tag.
We always kind of wanted one but figured we'd never find one. then one came up for sale early this year not too far from us. He pretty well has every model from the 20's to mid 50s'. but he was sick for awhile and wanted to do some thinning. he advertised quite a few. got rid of some extras but never ended up dipping into his complete collection, except for this one, sort of. he does have a restored red W and WD40 on factory rubber still left. we were lucky we had some $$ raised for something else but decide to buy this tractor instead! paid for it in february and finally got it in July. he was in and out of the hospital all spring for treatments etc. it was in the back of a shed with all the other models from this era. when we got it he said he wouldn't have felt bad giving our money back. as he figured he could get a couple k more.but its home now and in our shed.
it still has its original vertical injecter head. needs needs a bit of small stuff done but its overall in good shape. i've fixed up a set of extensions for it. i think we may take it to Rollag next time they feature IH. the 1st diesel built was #508. ours is tractor # 692 and block 611. a guy in ND has tractor # 633(570) and another early one we know of in Saskatchewan is the devils tractor #666 with block # 564. a guy in california told me this year he has 701.

Last edited by Colin; 11-15-2007 at 12:58 AM.
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Old 11-15-2007, 01:39 AM
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Also Eric can you find the block # of this one and your other ones? im trying to make a list of all the early ones.
i know i saw a '35' date on the bottom of the transmission on ours. ill have to look again for the dates and for more on other parts.
does this one have a "P' stamped on the plate (phnematic) 666 in Sask. does.
the Stants who own E&E have #8xx. the guy we got ours from said he had enough to build tractor #611. tried getting original front extensions from him but he wouldnt sell them might try to get a set made.
oh and the one he has left is a sister to another one not too far from here, i think they're 38's
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Old 11-15-2007, 07:40 AM
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Colin - That's a very nice tractor you have there. My tractor does not have the P. Technically, IH did not authorize pneumatic tires for the WD-40 until around September of 1935 so finding a "P" stamped on a number lower than 900 or so might be suspect.

That's not an aluminum tag on the radiator. Someone has painted the letters and created a background on there to look like the aluminum tag it's cast in place just as they should be through early 1936. I will get you the engine number and casting date on the tub, etc. It is true that 508 is the first PRODUCTION tractor but the pre-production tractors were built and I own 503. 501, 502, and 504 all still exist and I know the owners. 501, 502, and 503 were built a whole year before and have quite a few major differences. 504 was built in early 1935 and looks a whole lot more like the production tractors. I have the list of monthly first tractors and engines from the IH archives which helps a lot when determining pedigree. It's amazing how many of the early tractors have survived. I also own 543 and 592. A friend has 519 and another guy I know of has 523 so quite a few survived from the first 100 or so serial numbers. Also, the engine numbers almost never match and once they started full production on the 6 cylinder they start to fall behind the tractor numbers. Even the Nebraska test tractor was off by something like 33 serial numbers between the chassis and the engine. The last of the WD-40s will have chassis number in the 10,000 range and engine numbers in the 4000 range. That is because roughly 6,000 chassis were used for 6 cylinder tractors. On the last of the 6 cylinder tractors, you will see a difference reflective of roughly the number of diesels built.

These tractors came from up around Ottawa but I think that fellow had gotten several of them from out west.

Last edited by Eric Best; 11-15-2007 at 07:48 AM.
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Old 11-15-2007, 01:06 PM
Tony Thompson Tony Thompson is offline
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering


Thanks for all the great information in your post. I too am surprised at the high survival rate, but these are truly well built machines, and the enduring quality would certainly play a role in their survival
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Old 11-15-2007, 10:07 PM
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

According to my Nebraska test information, the test WD-40 was

Tractor 644 (the early tractors don't use the WDC prefix on the serial number
but just say WD40 in the model block of the tag)

Engine WDC-677
Injector Pump PT-3187

The tractor was tested from September 23-27, 1935.
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Old 11-15-2007, 10:43 PM
bocephus_k6 bocephus_k6 is offline
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Quote:
Originally Posted by Colin View Post
Also Eric can you find the block # of this one and your other ones? im trying to make a list of all the early ones.
i know i saw a '35' date on the bottom of the transmission on ours. ill have to look again for the dates and for more on other parts.
does this one have a "P' stamped on the plate (phnematic) 666 in Sask. does.
the Stants who own E&E have #8xx. the guy we got ours from said he had enough to build tractor #611. tried getting original front extensions from him but he wouldnt sell them might try to get a set made.
oh and the one he has left is a sister to another one not too far from here, i think they're 38's
I have a fellow collector up the road from me who has 3 WD40's, I will try and get the serial numbers off of his for you if you so wish .

Regards,

Brian
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Old 11-17-2007, 02:34 PM
Lyle Stomp Lyle Stomp is offline
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Clyde Hall's WD-40 is serial number 666 with the suffix P. It has French and Hecht wheels on it, 32 inch on the back and 20 inch on the front. It is currently going through a last bolt restoration.
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Old 11-19-2007, 12:52 PM
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Best View Post
Colin - That's a very nice tractor you have there...
That's not an aluminum tag on the radiator. Someone has painted the letters and created a background on there to look like the aluminum tag it's cast in place just as they should be through early 1936. I will get you the engine number and casting date on the tub, etc. .
Hi Eric. did you get some reasearch done on your early WD-40s.
The only dates i could find for now is one under the tractor. it was 5 28 35.
there was a mysteryous one on the mag side of the block which i dont think is a part number but could be. its 3162 D. "D" works back to casting code year 1934. so i wondered if this number could be something like March 16, 34. but the '2' throws it off. it was a few days since i looked but im pretty sure the part # and firing order were on the other side, so thats why i suspected this number to be a casting code.
did you determine if this one of yours has original paint. Something more on the radiators i kept forgeting to mention was, if yours had its original one on still with this good of paint it would have the vertical "Diesel" decal on it.
unfortunately all our deccals are pretty well weatherd off. you can still see a few little yellow ones but you can't read them. there was a pretty original WK-40 sitting beside ours in the shed where we got it. and it had a rad on it that said Diesel up the rad. so someone had obviously changed it at one time.
it would be interesting to see some documents and pictures of these pre- 508WD-40s. I know the guy we got ours from was skeptical, since he has had more than one guy tell him they have 501, or guys telling him about 501s in different places or something like that he's been into these tractors and the diesel cats in a big way for quite a few years now. we've just assumed that the first 7 were gas models. that was usually the case in most IH series. i think the MD's, WD'6s and 9's started at least a year later maybe two.
Ive also hever heard of an IH tractor series that included there experimentals in the production run. normally those models were tested the year before then taken back and dismantled, or made to look like the production tractors. did 501-507 have there own parts book? or did they just let them out in hopes they would never need major repair?
Sorry to doubt you on all this stuff but we've just got a lot of unanswered questions in this grey area of early WD-40s.
we have McCormick Super W-6 #507. sort of lucky to find it since we'll likely never come across another low # tractor for sale in this area.
Lyle do you have any pictures of 666? i forgot to take some of Marks 633 this fall.
Colin
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Old 11-19-2007, 10:47 PM
Guy Fay Guy Fay is offline
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

IH often included pre-production tractors in the serial runs. Pre-production tractors are not experimentals or prototypes, but tractors built to try out a production specification. Examples are the first 25 F-12s and the Frameall tractors (which actually didn't enter production, but they have their own serial number series that started at 501.

Other pre-production runs were put into the Q serial number series, which was reserved for the Gas Power Engineering Department at IH. Examples of Q serials for preproduction would be the first couple of runs of the Farmall Regular and the L series engines (and yes, I know the guys that own the L preproduction engines call them Model Q, and they're still wrong.) Qs were also used for straight prototype and experimental tractors, as well as individual parts, refrigerators, engines, blood coolers, furnaces, and the occaisional steam locomotor.
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Old 11-20-2007, 12:53 AM
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Thanks to Guy Fay for jumping in. Colin - I'll try not to sound too impatient or ill-tempered about this whole thing but what you have to know is that this ground has been plowed so many times for so many years that there's little more than dust left. Guy has done much of the necessary research at the archives in Madison, WI. There really aren't too many mysteries about the W-40 series tractors left to solve but I'll finish this reply with a couple of them after I respond to your specific points.

5-28-35 is the date your "tub" was cast (they used the US day-month-year and not the European date scheme, so this is May 28th, 1935). It should have some relationship to the date of manufacture in as much as the tractor could not have been assembled before the tub was cast. In fact, due to curing time and machining time, it was probably a minimum of 2 or 3 weeks before a tractor could actually be assembled on that casting. During 1936 when these things were being chucked out like cord-wood, I've seen casting dates in the same month as the approximate production month of the tractor (again, using the monthly production firsts list as a guide). Toward the end, when the 40s were trickling out, the tub castings are often months older than the tractor's approximate assembly date. In 1937, instead of using the year on the tub, you will primarily see a letter code (G for 1937, H for 1938, and I for 1939). While WD-40s were assembled in 1940, there were precious few and I suspect they were just using up 1939 castings as I have never seen a "J" code on the belly (but then, I'm only aware of one surviving 1940 WD40 and it is in the UK). The casting date for the crankcase is underneath the injector pump bracket and you can't see it without removing the bracket. There is another date cast on the timing cover but that part is easily changed ("easily" is a relative term if you've ever changed one of these!) Those are the three main dates that I am aware of.

The casting dates on the bellies of 502 and 503 are 1-30-34. 501 has a casting date of 3-31-34. I know the order's not right but that's how it is and I wouldn't take anything from it except that all three tractors may have been rebuilt from Q serial number tractors that were true experimentals and they probably weren't particular about which case they pulled for 501. All three tractors have part number extensions cast on the major castings. The extension is the same on all the parts and is the project number for the experimental tractors assigned by the Gas Power Engineering department Guy talks about. Even the goofy little angle irons used to mount the radiators on the pre-production tractors have these project numbers stamped in them. I believe the first casting run for the production tubs was in March or April of 1935. At least those are the earliest dates I have seen on a production tractor.

3162D is the basic part number for the crankcase casting and has nothing to do with dates. In fact, your crankcase should actually be a 3162DC crankcase, the fourth casting variation made by IH for the 40 diesel engine and the first series to be used in a production WD-40 tractor. The preproduction tractors (501 and 503 at least) used 3162DA crankcases (TDC-779 and 794 serial number respectively, pulled right off the crawler production in late 1933, early 1934). 3162DC is used through late 1935 when the water flow from the water pump is directed differently with crankcase 3162DD. This crankcase is used through the duration of the vertical heads which ends very, very early in the 1937 model year. 3162DE is the 10 degree head crankcase (mostly - some late 10 degrees use a different case with covers on the side similar to a TD-14). 6555D is the crankcase used on the factory 45 degree head tractors and strongly resembles a TD-14 crankcase. The true 3162D (no A, B, C, D, E, etc.) crankcase was used on only a handful of TD-40s and PD-40s at the beginning of production in 1933.

As Guy Fay will point out, pre-production tractors were often built to get the kinks out of the production assembly processes. I think that was probably true of 504 through 507 but 501 through 503 were more than likely just test mules put out to work to see if the technology would hold up in the hands of farmers. The history of 501 was told in an article in a 1950s dealer publication and the owners all the way up to the one prior to the gentleman who owns the tractor today were listed. What I'm saying is that the current owner bought it from the last owner listed in the 1950s dealer publication article. You can't get much better pedigree than that.

504 is actually the first tractor listed in the monthly production log and was "built" just a few days before 508.

On the subject of the parts book (TC-19) it covers only production tractors as you point out. The first printing of the 1935 Instruction Manual / Parts List does, however, contain many of the parts unique to the first 3 tractors. They always appear with an asterisk and the comment at the bottom of the page, "Used on a few tractors only. Supply serial number of tractor . . ." The little angle irons used to support the radiators on the pre-production tractors only actually appear in the parts list in this first printing. TC19 covers none of the 45 degree head tractor chassis changes as it was printed a month before the first 45 degree head tractor rolled off the line. For those parts, you nearly have to go to a 1939 or 1940 instruction guide and parts list for the WD-40. The cylinder head for the 45 degree engine makes an appearance in TC-19 but it was probably a mistake to include it without the pending chassis changes.

To see some of the interesting research by Guy Fay relating the production and pre-production decisions for the 40 series, see back issues of Red Power.

Here's what I think about the diesel Cat guy - I think I know him and he's just got a bee in his bonnet because the tractors aren't his. Heck, I freely admit I don't own the oldest or even the second oldest WD-40 but I don't lay awake at night worrying about how I can discredit the two people who can lay claim to those titles. WD40 #501 is in one and only one place and Heaven help us if it ever hits the auction block. Much of the skepticism (the Cat guy's and others) will be discarded in favor of a check book and friendly calls to bankers on that day.

Incidentally, my observations indicate that the diesel decal on the radiator doesn't appear until tractors beginning roughly in the 800 range. Until then, they only had the diesel decal on the fuel tank. For a while, both decals appear. By the end of 1935, only the vertical radiator decal remains. The decal sets sold today are garbage and nothing like the decals the tractors actually had, either in content or appearance.

Here are the things that I think are true mysteries remaining to be solved about 40 series tractors:

1) Prior to WA40 #934, the first PRODUCTION 6 cylinder, is it possible for a WA40 and WD40 to have the same chassis number? I suspect it is. The monthly lists show WA40 511 and 522 and they are in months that don't jive with WD40s of similar chassis numbers. This makes me think they were pulling serial numbers from two separate piles, early on. Also, 510 is claimed to exist in both WD40 and WA40. I have personally inspected WA40 510 and would certify its authenticity in a heartbeat except for the replacement engine. It apparently was built in 1934 along with the pre-production run of diesels and the features, including the radiator mounting, are the same as the diesels. I think after 934, there is almost zero possiblity of a 6 cylinder tractor and a diesel tractor having the same chassis number as they were pulling numbers from the same pile. So, maybe there was a WA40 501, etc. Then, there's an odd break in the monthly lists where some WD40 chassis numbers appear to go unused as if to indicate a need to synch up with the WA40 production annoucement (there was no WK-40 at this time as that tractor didn't appear on the scene until tractor WKC-1441 in December of 1935).

2) Were some WD40s painted red before the official change on November 1936 (1937 model year)? Among the folks I know, there seem to be at least some occurences of 5xx serial number tractors that have never been anything but red (ask Wendell Kelch about this). Maybe it was a promotional thing.

Sorry to go on for so long but the facts, to the extent they exist, are on my side on this one. I have done the research as have a few others. It is unfortunate that IH did not document things as well as JD but we have what we have, much of it thanks to Guy Fay's research at the archives at Madison, Wisconsin.

Last edited by Eric Best; 11-20-2007 at 12:58 AM.
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Old 11-21-2007, 01:58 AM
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Hi Eric, thanks for the info. I will have to do some digging to find all Guys info and stuff. it sounds interesting.
I know all about casting code dating. learnt that trick a few years ago and i pretty well go over every new tractor we get, and have checked out most of the ones we already have. Somtimes when looking at someones tractor and they dont know thay year we just say give us a minute to find a few dates, then we know right away. I have most letters memorized from the 40s to mid 50s. i always wondered if they meant to end the letter series in Z(1954) and start fresh with the hundred series with 'A'. or if it just worked out like that. T was 1950. W was 51(i dont think they used (U or V) and X is 52 and so on. so did they see the end of the letter series coming and miss a couple leters? maybe Guy knows.
Had a quick look at our 40 again tonight. i suspect the block date is above the firing order on the LH side. but i need to wire brush it to read it.
We know the guy pretty good we got our 40 from and he doesn't have a bee in his bonnet over these low #s. i think hes like us and just wanting to see some proof and #s to go along with the claims. and that reminds me do you have the block numbers from your early 40s and the ones you know about? whats the # on the one in this post? can you get a close up picture of the rad? This fellow i speak of(who we got our 40 from) has a very complete collection which he worked hard for and is proud of. starting with a 10-20 Titan and tractractor, 15-30 era, early W and Farmall seriers and all the letter and Number Farmall and W series to about 1957. Topped off with a fully restored W and WD40 on factory rubber. we always enjoy looking through his sheds and visiting with him. He knows these engines and injection pumps inside and out. he even explained to us about finding the vibration points on these motors. he worked for a local IH in the 40s and 50s when all these gas start diesels were in there prime. he talked about taking courses in the old IHC building in Brandon which is still standing. he learnt alot about pumps and heads etc. and they would even hack saw cracked WD9 heads apart to see what was causing the water restrictions or cracking. One of his hi-lights there was being one of the 1st in the area to start up and drive a new TD-6 on the lot.(sometime in the early 40s i forget date) i believe he said his dad owned a TD6 for awhile. im not sure if it was this one or another.
Hes also in the process right now of designing the corect style and size of tin work decals for the WD and TD 40s and 35s on the computer. the last time we were out there he had some samples made up.
I'm looking forward to getting ours out this spring. it just seemed like we could never find another afternoon to run it around and enjoy it. sure sounds good with the long strait pipe though Im glad it worked out that we were able to keep this tractor in the west here instead of it being wung to England or over into the US. only about 2 or 3 days went by from the time we saw the ad untill we bought it i know we beat out at least two guys who were humming and hawing. we all determinded this 40 had to be one of the 1st Diesels sold in Manitoba. and it turns out dad knew the guy who bought it new. him and his son were members of the Austin show way back. they bought this tractor to run a sawmill, since there 22-36 didn't have enough power. it also did a small amount of breaking and field work. its too bad the original owner is long gone and his son who was close to dads age was killed in an auger accident about 20 years ago.
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Last edited by Colin; 11-21-2007 at 02:15 AM. Reason: ad pic
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Old 11-21-2007, 11:47 PM
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Colin - here's the info I have so far on 715 (the tractor at the top of this thread). The engine number is WDC-608 and the block is a 3162DC part number. I can't see the casting date on the block because it's behind the injector pump bracket but I'll write it down when I take that apart, someday. I haven't knocked the grease off the bottom of the tub yet to see what casting date is on the chassis. I also own 716 (consecutive serial number to the tractor above). It's engine number is WDC-724. Again, the block casting is 3162DC.

I hope this is helpful information. I have attached a black and white of 716. Before you say anything, it is on the wrong wheels, has the wrong decals, wrong radiator sides (as does 692, I believe), etc. but it does still have the vertical head. There are probably a number of other things that aren't right about it.

Eric.
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Last edited by Eric Best; 11-21-2007 at 11:54 PM. Reason: Added Picture
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Old 11-22-2007, 11:39 AM
Tony Thompson Tony Thompson is offline
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering


The tractor on the trailer that Colin posted is a great looking survivor......I really like to see them in this nice straight original looking condition. Look at the lugs on that thing
Thanks for posting
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Old 11-22-2007, 11:54 AM
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

I agree, Tony. It's great to find them in such a well preserved state. Judging by the lugs, that old girl probably has spent a lot more hours on the belt than hooked to a plow.
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Old 11-23-2007, 07:40 PM
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Th<a href="http://photobucket.com" target="_blank"><img src="http://i178.photobucket.com/albums/w257/steelfronts/100_1205.jpg" border="0" alt="Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket"></a>is one has good lugs too
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Old 11-23-2007, 07:43 PM
K Cooke K Cooke is offline
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Old 11-23-2007, 09:39 PM
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Lets try one more time. Lugs and no lugs
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Old 11-26-2007, 12:03 AM
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Thanks for the pictures KCooke. is the steel wheeler and old #?
Someone really went the extra mile to make the neighbors and passers by think that he had an 'International 650' rather than just an old WD40.
pretty well all the 'hundred' F & W series tractors got there grills and hood sides painted white like the '50' series. and ive seen the odd Super M or W6&9 get white grills. but never anything as old as that!
I dont know how IH tractor line is not going strong today when they built such a good diesel tractor early on. especially when they had JD beat by about 25 years with a good 4 cylinder diesel engine. They had some bugs in the 4-560 series but got going good again in the '7-1206 and up series.
But i guess the "International Diesel" still lives on through Navistar... For those of us who drive Ford diesel pick ups or Semi's that use that brand of engine
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Old 12-15-2007, 04:55 PM
David Jones David Jones is offline
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Default Re: Repatriated WD40 McCormick Deering

Just a note about the color of early WD-40 McComricks, I own S/N 519 which was delivered new to Ray and Edith Batman in Perryton TX. I personally got to talk with Edith Batman and her son. Both have indicated to me that 519 was delivered as a "bright red" tractor. When I started tearing it down I verified this by removing the serial number tag and found only evidence of red paint behind it. I have found no evidence of any other color except red on the tractor. I am sure that some of these tractors were red prior to 1936 when the new paint decision was published.
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