Hydrogen Fuel

[stephen girouard]

all bull aside, anyone did this mason jar trick you can order the plans for & with what success? I'm not interested in theoretical bullshit . I'v worked with high pressure equipment & know about hydrogen gas use and its out of my relm to build ,store and use this at home in a large scale,i'v talked to afew oilfield engineers it was out of there relm also ,thats why were not drivin around in hydrogen cars. Lets keep this simple and real. I'm just askin before i waist alot of mason jars i could be usein to drink ethanol in.

[PaulGray]

Use the mason jar for sipping iced tea or storing loose change and don't waste your time. The amount of so-called brown gas (or vaporized BS) is minuscule compared to what would affect engine performance.

[Bruce Sutton]

I have a Dodge truck,318 engine, getting around 17mpg. Put on the Mason jar with the element inside hooked to hot side of switch. Distilled water and a pinch of baking soda in jar. Hydrogen line going to air intake on clean side of air filter, just before throttle body injector. A reostat type knob hooked into map sensor to trick computer. Another line hooked to vaccum on manifold and into hydrogen line. O2 sensors were insulated, not sure why. You could turn the knob and could tell it was making engine lean or the other way rich.I checked mileage every 200mi. Turned the knob every way you could. Mileage went all the way to 15mpg. Want to buy this setup cheap? Bruce

[stephen girouard]

dam bruce that sucks,hope you get your truck right again

[Bruce Sutton]

[quote=stephen girouard;325364]dam bruce that sucks,hope you get your truck right again[/QUOTETook all the stuff off. runs good now.

[Elden DuRand]

Gang:

If someone tells you that you can add a simple (or complex) gizmo to your fuel system and get great mileage, RUN - DON'T WALK!

Hydrogen may be a nice clean burning fuel but it's very expensive to extract from water (or anything else, for that matter).

You'd probably be better off collecting cow farts for your car.

Take care - Elden

[Brad Kelley]

When I was at Virginia Tech the Hybrid Electric Vehicle Team (HEVT) had a hydrogen powered Ford Explorer. I was working in the shop one day when one of the HEVT engineers came into the Baja car bay with the oil pan from their engine. He asked us if we could identify that milky substance in the oil pan. I told him it looked just like the exhaust out of a steam engine... oil and WATER. He slapped his forehead, because the byproduct of combusting hydrogen is H2O.

So, even if you get this mason jar contraption to work, you'd better add a water separator to your engine oil system.

[stephen girouard]

fogot about that!there's always a little blowby, that byproduct of regular combustion will wash a regular engine like a head gasket leak suckin in water, hell , what a bunch of CRAP ,best one yet

[Richard W.]

There are several videos on youtube about the HHO generator blowing up with out a flash back arrester.

Richard W.

[Dave Kane]

Well-sounds pretty negative.Belong to a group of 6 tring new things all the time.Have not found a solution that will withstand Michigan weather.Do some research on web & find people in your area using this.Numerous safegaurds to ad,but,old 78 ford-slightly built 460-8 miles a gallon.Added simple hyd-fuel cell,14 miles a gallon.I'm not very educated but this seems to be quit an improvement to me.Working on tricking sensors next.Guess we have long way to go,but a Saab-32 miles a gallon now at 43 miles a gallon.Guess I'l just keep to myself.Mason jar will not support surface area of electrolite but people say they work. Good luck

[Farquhar]

These rigs will work purty good on older engines without the oxygen sensors, etc. I wouldn't want to try it without a check valve/flacshback valve to prevent a backfire from stting off Hiroshima under the hood.

[Andrew Mackey]

Take the ford carb off the 460 and put on a Rochester Quadrajet. You will get 14 to 15 MPG without the gimmicks! A friend has a ford SCJ 429. He was getting 10 MPG with a Holley 650 on it. Changed it out to a Rochester and then got 16 MPG. Didn't take off quite so fast, but when the secondaries opened, watch out!

Andrew

[jht1057]

Hi All,

Just my .02 cents, I have a generator left over from Y2K, guy was getting rid of it because it had carb issues. Anyhow, I have managed to get it to run reasonably with a five gallon bucket sized HHO generator. The cost of the stainless plates and all the other hardware would have been a serious project stopper, had I not found most of it in various scrap piles.

I am not convinced that it would be a good idea to try any of this on a vehicle, but on something stationary, I had fun getting it to work. However, I also am not planning any further uses and probably won't go through the hassle to set it up again.

The theory and ideas have merit the costs and safety issues are pretty prohibitive.

Again, just my .02 cents

Jim

[Elden DuRand]

Jim:

If you want to do a neat experiment, get an old watt hour meter and hook it to the AC input to your hydrogen generator.

Now, figure out a way to measure the actual amount of work the engine can do on the hydrogen, generating electricity, for instance.

Run the hydrogen generator hard enough to just run the engine/generator lighting a string of light bulbs or other resistive load. Measure the load voltage and current and calculate the watts generated.

Run the outfit an hour with the hydrogen generator and note the KWH used to generate the hydrogen.

NOW, switch the engine back to gasoline (or whatever fuel it was originally running) on and repeat the experiment as exactly as you can and carefully measure the amount of fuel used.

Figure the electrical cost of running the generator on hydrogen and compare that with the cost of running the generator on conventional fuel.

I'll bet (and I ain't a bettin' man) that the cost of the hydrogen was much higher than that of the conventional fuel.

Same thing with using one of those toy generators on your car. The engine will waste many more times fuel generating the hydrogen than the hydrogen generator makes.

End of lesson.

Remember the three rules of Thermodynamics:
1: You can't win.
2: You can't break-even.
3: You can't lose.

Take care - Elden
http://www.oldengine.org/members/durand

[jht1057]

Elden,

Trust me I am fully aware of what you are saying and totally agree, as I had stated in my previous reply, I was just playing with the concept to see if there was enough brown gas output to actually run something on.

I had no preconceived ideas of saving huge amounts of money or even saving the world.

My project was what it was, a project.

Although watching the bubbles was the best part.

Jim

[OTTO-Sawyer]

Originally Posted by Andrew Mackey

Take the ford carb off the 460 and put on a Rochester Quadrajet. Andrew

Best Damn Carburator Ever Made.

That's why GM hung onto it as long as they did, well into the fuel injection age until they finaly got enough computer power hooked up to make them more efficient.

And contrary to popular belief, they're not that hard to work on or modify. With the vaccuum operated air valve (secondary choke?), it's impossible to Over-carburate, as it will only open as much as is needed for the engine size and RPM. Spend $300.00+ on a Holly and then spend another $200-$300.00 to make it match your motor.... No Thanks, I'll take a $2.00 junk yard Quadrajet any day. Throw in a $20.00 rebuild kit, and it will handle just about any engine you mount it on ! (Except a diesel of course !)