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Chain Saw Collectors Vintage chainsaws and other small gas engine saws, collecting and restoring.

Chain Saw Collectors

Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more


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  #1  
Old 03-29-2009, 12:24 PM
Peter Peter is offline
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Default Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

I was perusing EBAY just trying to scope out the situation with Stihl 090. It appears there was a smaller displacement twin called the 070. And the 090 was available in several models plain,AV, etc and also found a reference to a 10 cubic inch 090. Where the biggest 090, I thought, was 137 cc or so that equal 8 cu in more less. (I dont, memorizing odd numbers is not my strong suite.)

Can 070 have new top end conversion to 090? I wonder becasue I see a whole raft load of hi dollar 090 on EBAY and not a single 070. Lots of newly painted saws. So my radar is turned on and I am sweeping the skys?

Can anyone elaborate what the diff is amoung all the 070, 090 models?

I saw one potential bidder asking for serial numbers for an 090. Why would he ask that? What are the 090 serial numbers ranges?
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Old 03-29-2009, 04:45 PM
bill chasser bill chasser is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

Well the 090 is the largest single man saw stihl made and was designed as a felling saw. It's replacement became the 088 now ms880. I believe the 090 is still available new but not here in the states. As for the 070, it's replacement became the 066 and now the ms660.

I don't believe that you can build a 070 into a 090. just like you can't make a o88 from an 066. similiar designs but not the same.

The AV model denotes ARCTIC VERSION. These saws have heated handles and carburators for operator comfort and ease of operation in bone chilling temps.

Hope this helps a little.

Bill
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Old 03-29-2009, 05:03 PM
Sky
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

There was also the stihl lightning S, which is (if i have my info correct) the second biggest. I think they were 12 BHP 12.5 BHP somewere in that range. 090 @ 13 BHP. Word is that the lightning derived from the 070 but the 090 would be the next one up from the lightning. Every sence i caught a slight chain saw "2 cycle bug" as i call it, i always wanted a lightning S, or a 090.....but i cant afford one. Not at no $1200 PLUS. Beautiful saws they are though. Good for cutting down houses and giant sekoya's (probably spelled that wrong) which are now a protect species and as for the lightning's. Very rare. Almost extinct.

Last edited by Sky; 03-29-2009 at 05:13 PM.
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Old 03-29-2009, 07:48 PM
sawcollector sawcollector is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

I am by no means the 090 expert but I can share a little bit.
Here is the 090 I have in my collection:



The main difference between a 070 and a 090 is the bore. A 090 has a 66mm piston, the 070 and the 090G (gear drive) have a 58mm piston.
The 090 AV means it has an anti-vibe handle. Mine is not an AV model. The early models had a small diameter pipe curving up over the top pf the saw as part of the AV system. The current production, still made by hand on a line in Wablingen, uses a rear handle with the buffers built in. To my knowledge there was never a heated handle Arctic version in this series of saw.
There was a small batch of 10 cube saws made for a racing program, and they are very rare. A fellow collector I know has one and the way to tell is that the deco valve is in a different place on the top of the cylinder.
This is a very desirable saw to have in a collection, but beware of eBay as they get mocked up and built out of junk all the time for that reason.
The Lightning/Contra was the predecessor to the 070/090 and is similar except for having a different filter and top cover.
The 090 is direct drive but will pull 1/2" chain on a long bar if needed. The G model is a real torque monster but is very heavy to lug around.
HTH
Eddie
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Old 03-29-2009, 11:21 PM
Peter Peter is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

great! thank you sawcollector,

I hesitate to ask, but just for my information, do you knwo: what would a new 090 cost? No bar. Would a direct from Germany be the way to go? I probably never do this, but I cannot believe it would be more than some of the EBAY prices.

Peter
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Old 03-30-2009, 07:54 PM
sawcollector sawcollector is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

STIHL will not sell direct to anybody anywhere.
I was at the plant in Germany in 2007 and when I saw the line where they were building them I asked the tour guide if I could buy one and was told emphatically "NO". I am not ever sure they retail them in Germany. He told me they mainly make them for non-emissions law countries that use them for saw mills, or to Africa or South America where they are still used for felling. You would have to find someone willing to buy it from a dealer in a country where they do sell them and have it shipped over and i have heard that the customs folks may cause some trouble. I suppose the best way around it would be to have them ship it to you as parts, if you ever find anyone to do it.
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Old 03-30-2009, 08:20 PM
Peter Peter is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

I went to a dealer today and essentially he told me the same thing. these saws , 090, do not meet emission stds for US or Canada. I did plan to try and contact the factory in Germany but now I will not bother. I guess I can live without an 090.

The actual retail for an 088 brand new is 1/2 even 1/3 the cost some of the ebay 090 prices. Buy why did they reduce the 088 displacement? Cosmetically the 090 looks better too. And little details like filler caps that really seal up tight. Easy access to replace starter cords. Really, those stupid 1/2 twist oil & gas caps are a total POS, leaky pain in the a$$.

I have a recent 260 and I can say for sure, its better to stick with a pro series saw. I woud expect more ballz from a stihl. I had a 020 AVP (professional) and that could almost equall the 026. Not quite. Man could that little saw cut. My 028 was good worker. And I still run an old 056 that can kill any tree in the part of the country. It seems like one thing in life you can count on, is once a brand gets on top of the heap, they cash in on the reputation with some cheep grade products. Or...

Maybe the emissions standards hurt some too? I have just assumed the 088 could cut the equall of the 090. I wonder.... maybe not and all more reason I would expect the 088 to be more like 150cc engine.
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Old 04-01-2009, 09:15 PM
sawcollector sawcollector is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

Peter, the old 090 was a torque monster and a beast to run.
This is my 084 with a 48" bar with full skip chain buried full length in a willow oak we had to get rid of at my church a couple of years ago.



If you have need to cut with a long bar the 084 is much better, in my opinion, than an 090. Now I know some will say I'm wrong but the fact is that when I need to cut big wood this saw is easier to start, has a full anti-vibe system, has a chain brake, and will just do the job better. You can still get parts for it and with a little bit of tweaking it will out cut a new MS 880 any day of the week.
I love the old STIHL saws and I have the 090, an 07, a 051, 041, 040, 030, and others and they are a blast to collect, but as I have said on other forums, that when it is time to cut I grab the lightest, easiest to start, softest handle mount saw I can to get the job done. Any more for around the house I find myself more and more just grabbing the MS 192. It is super light, has the Easy2Start starter system and a primer so 2 pulls and it is off and running, and with my torn shoulders and arthritis it is easy on my body.
The old saws are fun to cut a couple of biscuits off a log once in a while but not for serious cutting. But they are fun to look at too!
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Old 04-16-2009, 12:54 AM
marcomartignoni marcomartignoni is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

Hi!
Can I add some info about biggest stihl chainsaws?
Stihl contra (1959-1968) was the first "largest crankcase" stihl, it was 106 cc and 58 mm cylinder/piston bore. It had a power of about 6 PS. Then was produced the biggest stihl contra s (s=super) with a 137 cc. and 66 mm cylinder/piston bore (1964-1968) and 8 PS. To install this biggest cylinder stihl enlarged a little with a boring machine the crankcase in the cylinder basament lodging (from about 64 mm to about 74 mm). Contra S had also a different cylinder cover (the metal one) as the cylinder is a little biggest than the 106 cc, and has also a different fan cover.Contra G (G=gear) has another right crankcase, with a reduction rate (2:1). It was 106 cc (contra G) or 137 cc (contra GS). Other variant was the AV (=anti vibration) handle, mounted on some stihl contra S.
On all contras no decompression valve and the spark plug is not central but is orizzontal on the left side and has long thread. All contras had a zinc cylinder cover, to allow cooling, and on the top a red plastic cover (covering zinc cover and air filter).
In 1968 contras were replaced by 070/090 series: same crankcase of contra s (with big bore basament lodging, so you can mount both 070 = 106 cc. or 090= 137 cc.) and different cylinders, with decompression valve and central spark plug (short thread). Also the external shape of the cylinder is a little different (biggest cooling system of the head) but disposition of all the windows of cylinder (sorry for my english i don't know if the term windows is correct), the exaust and the porting/intake ones are identical to the ones of contra and contra s. Power is little more (070 is about 6,5 PS, 090 about 8,5 PS, maybe becouse of the more performant shape of the piston and air filter. Different is also the 070/090 carburetor (from a Tillotson HL 112, contra, to a Tillotson HL 324, with different position of the carburation screws but identical venturi diameter, so same performance).To allow the more cooled cylinder the cover is now a biggest orange metal one including also air filter. Also contra G was relaced by 090G but, I think it was only 106 cc.
090 had a different fan cover from the 070, the same of contra s. 090 is produced by now for Australia, South Africa and maybe Mexico or Brazil (perhaps for Mexico 070) with a new shape Anti Vibration handle and safety systems. So very little differences from the oldest contra to the recent/actual 070/090. Crank case is, practically, the same of 1959!!!!!

An answer: Has anybody other information about the special 090 with 10 cubic inches (164 cc.)? Cylinder bore? piston stroke? has anybody one of this kit or a picture/drawing?
Thanks
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Old 04-16-2009, 07:15 AM
Peter Peter is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

Macro,

Do you know, can an 070 be rebuilt to make an 090 with new top end and covers?
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Old 04-16-2009, 11:26 AM
sawcollector sawcollector is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

I hope it is OK to post a link to another forum here???

http://www.chainsawcollectors.se/php...it=10+cube+090

This is the discussion about the 10cube 090 and there is a pic of one from Wayne Sutton's collection, and some good reading about the differences between it and a regular 090.
This should answer your questions Marco, and thanks for the info on the Contra and 090 saws.

Peter, I can't remember if the stroke and crankcase are the same on an 070 vs. 090. But the parts are hard to come by and pricey so if you had them all in my opinion it would be best to keep the saw original if possible. At least for the old saws, anyway. I am not opposed to a little tweaking here and there on later model stuff where spares are readily available and not to costly, but I would not try to do anything to my 090 to modify or change it as it runs good like it is, and I want to keep it stock.
Just my thoughts...
Eddie
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Old 04-17-2009, 12:42 PM
petesoldsaw petesoldsaw is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

Hello Eddie
That 090 Stihl is a great looking saw!There was one for sale about an hour east of me a month ago,for $1800.00.It was origonaly owned buy a fella that bought it new,he came home with it, put it on the shelf in the garage and he passed away a few days later,the saw had been gathering dust till it was sold.
Lawrence
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Old 04-18-2009, 11:39 AM
sawcollector sawcollector is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

Lawrence, that sounds like a story I heard about a Corvette! LOL
One thing for sure, Ebay has opened up the market for collecting saws and also driven up the price considerably for the rarer collectible saws, although I have noticed that prices seem to be coming down some lately. I guess due to the sour economy.
I have learned that the main thing is to be patient and network with others on the forums, and I get most of my saws by helping out folks with repairs or trading. I have over 100 saws but have only paid money for a few.
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Old 04-18-2009, 01:00 PM
petesoldsaw petesoldsaw is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

Hi Eddie
Man you hit the nail on the head about receiving these saws,you just hve to sit back sometimes and let them come to you.A fella I know from another site has people dropping saws off on his doorstep,they know he likes the old ones.When I first started out on this saw adventure this same fella was kind enough to help me out with information about the old Pioneer saws so I figure it is only right to continue to do the same.I have been gathering IPL's and service bulletins for the old IEL;s and Pioneers and offer to scan information for others that are in search for this information.About the corvette story,how did the fella get it on the shelf LOL!
Lawrence
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:14 PM
sawcollector sawcollector is offline
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Default Re: Stihl 070 vs 090 please tell me more

The Vette story is the one about the soldier that put it up on blocks and then got killed in the Nam and it sat for years before the Mom finally passed away and it was discovered, or some such similar tale told and retold along the same lines. I have heard a few about saws as well.
My wife doesn't mind me collecting saws since they take up a lot less room than Vette's or motorcycles! LOL
And since I get most of them for free, too!!!
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