Generators and Motors
[Home] - [HELP] - [Forums] - [Articles] - [Photo Gallery] - [Groups] - [Chat] - [Classified Ads] - [Subscribe] - [Links] - [Books] - [Sponsors] - [Tools]

Go Back   SmokStak > SmokStak® Vintage Electrical Equipment > Generators & Motors General Discussion
Forgot Password? Join Us!

Notices

Generators & Motors General Discussion Antique Generators, Light Plants and Old Electric Motors: Questions and answers about restoring and showing old power generation systems.

Generators & Motors General Discussion

12 volt DC starter direction change


I am working on an engine starter and need to change the direction the starter motor runs from...

this thread has 12 replies and has been viewed 7705 times

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 08-10-2010, 07:28 PM
Dwayne Fuller's Avatar
Dwayne Fuller Dwayne Fuller is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Longview, Texas USA
Posts: 1,389
Thanks: 2,265
Thanked 2,155 Times in 588 Posts
Default 12 volt DC starter direction change

I am working on an engine starter and need to change the direction the starter motor runs from counter clockwise to clockwise. I have limited knowledge of dc motors and am wondering how to change the direction. I tried swaping the positive and negetive leads on the battery and the starter motor still ran the same direction. Any help will be appreciated.
Attached Thumbnails
DSC01497.JPG   DSC01498.JPG  
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 08-10-2010, 08:10 PM
Danno Danno is offline
Registered-III
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Shellbrook, Saskatchewan, Canada
Posts: 148
Thanks: 1,165
Thanked 231 Times in 66 Posts
Default Re: 12 volt DC starter direction change

you would need a different starter or at least the armature and shaft as the spline on the shaft would have to be different direction
cheers,
Dan

---------- Post added at 08:10 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:02 PM ----------

sorry didnt look at the pic, just the question...
but that does not look like an engine starter to me
what application is that engine starter in?
make model ect will probably help
cheers
Danno
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 08-10-2010, 08:19 PM
heins heins is online now
Registered-III
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Kit Carson, Colorado USA
Posts: 926
Thanks: 208
Thanked 517 Times in 287 Posts
Default Re: 12 volt DC starter direction change

I changed the direction a 12 volt starter turned one time buy switching the wires inside the starter. I can't remember what I did with the starter drive. It was on an army Jeep engine that the starter mounted from the back.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 08-10-2010, 08:23 PM
armandh armandh is offline
Sponsor
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Suburban St. Louis, Missouri
Posts: 1,903
Thanks: 35
Thanked 323 Times in 289 Posts
Default Re: 12 volt DC starter direction change

swapping the two brush leads will reverse a brush type motor
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to armandh:
  #5  
Old 08-10-2010, 08:28 PM
Tony Rye Tony Rye is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Mobile, Alabama
Posts: 282
Thanks: 11
Thanked 53 Times in 51 Posts
Default Re: 12 volt DC starter direction change

unhook the solnoid than hook + to starter housing and -to lug on starter should run in other direction if you need to swap back and forth it will take a little work .this works on most starters. cant see how yours is wired in picture.sometimes thinks that the starter is powering will come apart turning in a diffent rotaion
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 08-10-2010, 08:59 PM
Jack Hottel Jack Hottel is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Haymarket, Virginia, USA
Posts: 698
Thanks: 186
Thanked 314 Times in 209 Posts
Default Re: 12 volt DC starter direction change

Permanent magnet field DC motors can be reversed by changing the voltage polarity, which you said was not successful. Wound field DC motors Can be reversed by changing the polarity to the brushes, or by changing the polarity to the field windings, but not both! Good luck.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Jack Hottel:
  #7  
Old 08-10-2010, 10:17 PM
Jim Rankin Jim Rankin is online now
Registered-III
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Faunsdale, Alabama USA
Posts: 4,061
Thanks: 41
Thanked 1,097 Times in 875 Posts
Default Re: 12 volt DC starter direction change

The usual way to swap the rotation is to get another brush rig that is indexed a quarter turn from the other one (4 brush type motor). If the one you have can be modified so it can be installed a quarter turn from the way it is, the motor should run the other direction. Watch out, the brush holders are either insulated from the frame of the brush rig or grounded to it, so don't swap a + brush into a - slot and short the whole works out.

Local generator/starter shop put a new set of brushes in a 12 volt hydraulic power pak we have. Got it back and it ran but wouldn't operate the ram. It had been working fine until it got unreliable because the brushes were so short, so I knew what the trouble was, but it took some convincing to get him to change out the new brush rig. He was just certain it was the same kind that came out of it, but obviously not.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 08-10-2010, 10:19 PM
Dwayne Fuller's Avatar
Dwayne Fuller Dwayne Fuller is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Longview, Texas USA
Posts: 1,389
Thanks: 2,265
Thanked 2,155 Times in 588 Posts
Default Re: 12 volt DC starter direction change

Thanks for the help guys! I switched wires on the brushes and it changed directions. I am using this to start a 25hp Reid gas engine.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 08-11-2010, 07:22 AM
grub54891 grub54891 is offline
Registered-III
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Washburn, Wisconsin USA
Posts: 835
Thanks: 1,252
Thanked 232 Times in 169 Posts
Default Re: 12 volt DC starter direction change

Wouldn't you have to change the starter drive also??
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to grub54891:
  #10  
Old 08-11-2010, 08:12 AM
armandh armandh is offline
Sponsor
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Suburban St. Louis, Missouri
Posts: 1,903
Thanks: 35
Thanked 323 Times in 289 Posts
Default Re: 12 volt DC starter direction change

if he will be using a bendix type engagement he will need a marine unit for reverse rotation [if they were ever made] if it is to be some sort of friction drive or manual engagement ... no problem
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 08-11-2010, 08:41 AM
K D Redd K D Redd is offline
In Memory Of
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Southwest Missouri
Posts: 5,348
Thanks: 166
Thanked 1,202 Times in 1,063 Posts
Default Re: 12 volt DC starter direction change

The easiest automotive starter to reverse is the Chrysler Gear reduction starter from the 60's, 70's and early 80's. This starter has the armature and the fields in series. Most starters are series/parallel wired.
I have built two electric winches using the Chrysler starter.
The Chrysler starter is wired as follows: The plus side of the battery is connected to an internal solenoid switch, easily bypassed. The solenoid connects the plus side of the battery to two brushes that are positioned 180 degrees apart on the armature commutator. Two other brushes which are also 180 degrees apart are positioned 90 degrees from the previous brushes. These brushes are connected to a field coil. The Chrysler starter has four field coils. Some have three coils wound from large wire and one with small wire. These starter have the three field coils with the large wire wired in series. The field coil wound with the light wire is in parallel with the three coil wound with large wire. I read some where long ago that the field coil wound with the small wire slowed the speed of the starter. I always cut the wire to this field coil when I work on this type starter. The "High Torque"version of this starter has four field coils all wired in series. The other end of the field coils is connected to the case of the starter. The case is the negative connection for the starer.
To reverse the direction of rotation on this starter, all you need to do is to separate the connection of the brush set from the one end of the field coil and the other end of the field coil from the case. If you connect the end of the field coil that WAS connected to the case to the brush set and connect the end of the field coil to the case ( Ground ) that WAS connected to the brush set, the motor will rotate the other direction. You can use four Ford type starter solenoid to make the connections. You might want to use ones with coil that are rated for continuous duty but I have used just regular Ford starter solenoids.

Kent
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 08-11-2010, 09:32 AM
armandh armandh is offline
Sponsor
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Suburban St. Louis, Missouri
Posts: 1,903
Thanks: 35
Thanked 323 Times in 289 Posts
Default Re: 12 volt DC starter direction change

yep they were easy to work on atop those slant 6s
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 08-12-2010, 08:22 AM
K D Redd K D Redd is offline
In Memory Of
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Southwest Missouri
Posts: 5,348
Thanks: 166
Thanked 1,202 Times in 1,063 Posts
Default Re: 12 volt DC starter direction change

Ain't that the truth. Drove a slant motor for years. Even built one for a turbocharger. Twenty PSI of boost. I was hoping to install a Hilborn constant flow fuel injection so I could run "Clear Fuel" Methanol but this was about the time I lost my job at Zenith to Mexico. I never had the funds to complete.

Kent
Attached Thumbnails
IMG_0607.JPG  
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

F o r u m Jump

Similar Threads Chosen at Random
Thread Thread Starter F o r u m Replies Last Post
12 volt starter for an 032 engine Tom Hook Military MEP and Aircraft Gen-Sets 28 11-25-2013 07:36 PM
Lincoln mod225-3as change starter to 12 volts Jerry Scholton Welding Shop 2 05-05-2010 06:12 PM
Change out speed change lever IHC LA 3-5hp engine Stevie Antique Gas Engine Discussion 1 02-15-2010 01:43 AM
Delco Remy Volt. Reg. & Starter/Gen. Jim Nixon Garden Tractors / Mowers / Scooters 1 08-21-2008 10:00 AM
Wico direction change, please help! MDoubell Magnetos, Ignition Coils and Spark Plugs 7 09-08-2007 08:32 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:52 PM.

Smokstak and Enginads site search!


All use is subject to our TERMS OF SERVICE
SMOKSTAK® is a Registered Trade Mark
A Community of Antique Engine Enthusiasts
Copyright © 2000 - 2014 by Harry Matthews
P.O. Box 5612 - Sarasota, FL 34277