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Generators & Motors General Discussion Antique Generators, Light Plants and Old Electric Motors: Questions and answers about restoring and showing old power generation systems.

Generators & Motors General Discussion

Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.


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  #1  
Old 09-07-2010, 11:55 PM
Bad5.9Cummins00 Bad5.9Cummins00 is offline
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Question Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Hi new here. I have a coleman powermate maxa 5000 er generator. It has the 10hp Tecumseh engine and have had it for about 10 years or so used it all the time when I first got it for 3 or 4 years then moved and put it in the back of my garage for 5 years never used it. I did drain all the gas out before storing. Couple months ago got it out to use at camp cleaned carb first and it started and worked other than having a little rev that went up and down but it ran good was done using it got it out the next day and wouldnt start sprayed starting fluid and it ran for a sec then shut off. So I put it back in the garage till 2 days ago when the power went out gave me the idea to try and fix it. I cleaned the bowl and blew out all the holes took the line off from the tank and used a bottle to fill the carb and it did start for about 5 sec so I figured maybe out of gas tried it again then quit a sec later I messed with it for a hr or two I did reconnect the gas line to the tank and put a little bit of gas in it I did get it to run for about 2 min but was reving up and down real bad I tried to mess with the fuel screws hoping to level it out but stalled it and now it wont restart its back to doing its run for a sec and then quit which you can only get it to do that once every couple hrs. Help guys could really use this generator right now hate to let it sit.
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Old 09-08-2010, 06:53 AM
armandh armandh is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

I have a similar colman gen & engine and they are picky about the fuel mixture for starting/steady running. [on mine the main mixture is the screw on the bottom]

start/quit/wont run for a while,,,, I would think flooding or too rich

assuming the float valve is working right
screw the mixture shut and open a bit at a time while trying to start
try a few hundred watts of load [as few run steady unloaded]
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Old 09-08-2010, 08:14 AM
K D Redd K D Redd is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

The Tec. carbs. is a PIA to work on. I have work on them for YEARS in the Lawn and Garden end of small engines. The idle passage in these carbs are VERY small and in a difficult location to clean. IF any moisture or old gas is in the carb it can screw things up. The passages are so small a dunking type carb cleaner IS NOT able to clean the passages. One day in frustration with a Tec. carb., I used a band saw to cut it up so I could better understand it. It had had water in it that had sat a LOOONG time. After this I understand them better and can make them run BUT I STILL HATE TO WORK ON THEM.

Kent
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Old 09-08-2010, 01:50 PM
Alan Rudd Alan Rudd is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Quote:
Originally Posted by K D Redd View Post
The Tec. carbs. is a PIA to work on. I have work on them for YEARS in the Lawn and Garden end of small engines. The idle passage in these carbs are VERY small and in a difficult location to clean. IF any moisture or old gas is in the carb it can screw things up. The passages are so small a dunking type carb cleaner IS NOT able to clean the passages.
Kent
I also despise Thescumbag carbs.... Unfortunately the only way to clean out those small passages is to run a wire or a tip cleaner through them. Some of them have welch plugs that will need to be removed so you can get to the passages.

Another thing I have noticed is that alloy they use is quickly destroyed by the least amount of water.

Alan
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Old 09-08-2010, 01:53 PM
FarmallBob FarmallBob is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Those Tecumseh engines are notorious for that kind of problem - especially if they've been sitting idle a while. You might try this:

Remove the nut that holds the bowl to the carburetor, then unscrew the mixture adjusting needle from the nut.

Now find the small orifice on the barrel of the bowl nut. It's located between the two threaded portions of the nut. The hole is TINY (like 0.008") and is angled upward toward the center of the nut. It can be difficult to spot if the nut has any varnish, etc on it.

Poke a fine wire thru the orifice then blow it clear.

Finally reassemble and give it a try. You'll probably have to readjust the high speed mixture (start with 1-1/2 turns out).

Good luck!
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  #6  
Old 09-08-2010, 04:47 PM
Arkie Arkie is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Give the carb a good cleaning and use some air blow through the orffice holes and also make sure that the filter and screens between the tank and the carb inlet are not clogged or restricted! Some have a screen inside the tank that comes out when the fuel shut-off is unscrewed from the tank and also a fine screen inside the settling bowl area of the shut-off petcock valve!

You can also get a carb kit! Be aware that Tecumseh carb's nowdays are kinda pricy, like $70 and up for new and most of the replacements are the Al Gore non-adjustable type that really make a generator non-user friendly due to their cold weather surging and hunting and the Adjustable jet types are kinda hard to find and pricy! I installed a Tecumseh 632242 adj jet carb on a 10 hp tecum awhile back and it operates A-OK! The carb was new from e-bay at about $65! give it a shot of sea foam in the gas after you get it going!
You can also review carbs and replacements at this link!

Link to view Tecumseh carb replacements!
Also go to HOME and see page 1

Note the FIND search instructions at the top of the page!

http://www.psep.biz/store/tecumseh_c...s_-_page_2.htm


---------- Post added at 03:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:45 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arkie View Post
Give the carb a good cleaning and use some air blow through the orffice holes and also make sure that the filter and screens between the tank and the carb inlet are not clogged or restricted! Some have a screen inside the tank that comes out when the fuel shut-off is unscrewed from the tank and also a fine screen inside the settling bowl area of the shut-off petcock valve!

You can also get a carb kit! Be aware that Tecumseh carb's nowdays are kinda pricy, like $70 and up for new and most of the replacements are the Al Gore non-adjustable type that really make a generator non-user friendly due to their cold weather surging and hunting and the Adjustable jet types are kinda hard to find and pricy! I installed a Tecumseh 632242 adj jet carb on a 10 hp tecum engine generator awhile back and it operates A-OK! The carb was new from e-bay at about $65! give it a shot of sea foam in the gas after you get it going!
You can also review carbs and replacements at this link!

Link to view Tecumseh carb replacements!
Also go to HOME and see page 1

Note the FIND search instructions at the top of the page!

http://www.psep.biz/store/tecumseh_c...s_-_page_2.htm

corrected some typo errors!
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  #7  
Old 09-08-2010, 09:35 PM
Bad5.9Cummins00 Bad5.9Cummins00 is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Thnks for the replys guys im going to try and work on it more on fri when im not so busy. I hope to get it running.
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Old 09-08-2010, 10:13 PM
Arkie Arkie is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Also when a Tecumseh is hunting and surging it's starving for fue, running lean!

You can sometimes confirm this lean condition and starving for fuel by applying a slight choke or placing your fingers over the carb intake so as to reduce the air intake! Make sure you do not have a air leak behind the carb at the riser intake pipe or at the engine block, whch will also cause the lean condition!
But most generally when the unit has been left sitting for long term storage the carb orffice ports are slightly clogged and restricted and the carb need and good carb cleaner soaking for at least 12-24 hours and then compressed air shot through all the orffice ports! If no go then it's usually time for new carb or pull the welch plugs and clean again!
!
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Old 09-08-2010, 11:53 PM
Bad5.9Cummins00 Bad5.9Cummins00 is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Sorry to ask guys but I am only 18 carbs arent my thing anyway so the screw on the bottom of the bowl is the fuel mixture screw? whats the one on the side of the carb for and about where should each be set?
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  #10  
Old 09-09-2010, 01:50 AM
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John Newman, Jr. John Newman, Jr. is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Picture below is a 10 hp Tecumseh on a 5000 watt generator. Should be pretty similar to yours.
The needle valve screw on the bottom of the carb bowl is the high speed (or 'Running') jet adjustment. The smaller one on the side of the carb is the idle mixture needle screw. Unless your generator has an "Idle Down" feature, it should be set to run at 3600 rpm whenever it is running. It would never really need the idle circuit that this screw adjusts. It could, however, affect the throttle response when a sudden heavy load is put on the generator. The screw in the throttle is to adjust the idle speed - which you would do AFTER getting the idle mixture set with the needle.
A good starting setting would be about 1-1/2 to 1-3/4 turns open on the high speed and between 1 & 1-1/2 turns on the idle needle screw.
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  #11  
Old 09-09-2010, 07:15 AM
Arkie Arkie is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Here is a couple of links you can try and download and save to your computer a free service manual for your tecumseh L-Head 10 hp! It will explain the carb's how to adjust plus all kinds of good info! I have not been too these links in awhile! I just print the pages of concern when I'm flogging a tecumseh!


http://www.cpdonline.com/692509.pdf


http://www.smallenginesurplus.com/se...-reference.pdf
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Old 09-09-2010, 08:14 AM
armandh armandh is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Two addendum

for those who grew up in the world of FI and never had a carb apart, the experience can be avoided with staybil or some other fuel additives and the avoidance of "green" gasoline. stick to real gas.

another more esoteric cause of hunting is the governor spring rate and positional inverse feed back. if the spring is in the same line as the carb linkage and long/thin enough to provide nearly the same pull through out the range then the tension increase as the throttle is pulled shut by the governor is what little of this inverse feed back there is. in the same plane as the governor link arm; if the fixed end is farther from the pivot point there is more inverse feedback [less hunting], closer to the pivot point less feedback and thus more sensitive. [to the point of going over center and becoming positive feedback] there is a good description of the adjustment in the Kohler K series 582 engine manuals [set up for a fixed speed] pg 26 [attached photo]

PS; John thanks for fixing mine, and the engine looks just like your picture.
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Last edited by armandh; 09-09-2010 at 11:03 AM.
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Old 09-09-2010, 09:02 AM
K D Redd K D Redd is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Even in a generator, when running at a low load, if the idle circuit on the carb is plugged, the engine may hunt. 99% of engine hunting problem is in the idle circuit. What happens is the governor close the throttle to limit the engines speed. If the idle circuit is plugged or even set lean, the engine starves for fuel, rpm drops and the throttle open. This cycle then repeats.
I also know all about using wire to clean the passages in a Tec. carb. I have even modified one of the Tec. diaphragm carbs for LP uses on a 5 HP/130000 series Briggs.

Kent
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Old 09-09-2010, 10:26 AM
Arkie Arkie is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

I've done mod's to the Al Gore non-adjustable tecumseh type carbs like in the pic on the genertor to stop or reduce the cold weather hunting and surging when the engine is first started up cold and the mod will make the engine just die instead of hunting and surging when it's running out of fuel!

The mod takes about 15 minuites once you have done a carb and the carb can remain on the engine! (This is for the non-adjustable jet carb only and will not make a bad carb good, it's for just stopping or reducing the hunting and surging when the engine is cold, which stop the voltage from surging on a generator! The initial cost of the mod is approx $20!

Like the guys say the use of sta bil or sea foam will help during storage, but Al Gore gas alchol is a bad thing for gen's! (and KD is right on about the idle ckt restriction causing the hunting or the carb slightly mis-adjusted in the adj type carbs! The idle orffice is purposely restricted in the non-adjustable Al Gore carbs for lean conditions which can be aggravating, causing gen voltage surging!:
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Old 09-09-2010, 03:19 PM
Bad5.9Cummins00 Bad5.9Cummins00 is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Thanks guys its much appreciated. I might get around to looking at it tonight if not def tom ill let you know how it goes.
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Old 09-09-2010, 08:05 PM
K D Redd K D Redd is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Speaking of lean conditions. My nephew ask me the other day if I could look at a new Stihl MS-160C he had. He could not get it to run. I told he if it was new he need to take it back to the dealer. He said THAT WAS THE PROBLEM. This was the THIRD one they had given him and NONE would run at wide open throttle so you could cut with it.
I looked at it. You could get it to run if the choke was about 1/2 closed. I opened the carb which is fixed jet unit. I called a Stihl dealer I do a lot of business. I ask them if there were various size jets for this carb. THERE IS NOT because of air pollution/EPA regs. I did find out the size of the main jet. It is .45MM. So I took out my pin vice and drill card for the # 80 through #61 drills and opened the main jet up to a #75 drill which is about .57MM. The saw is NOW usable. I found out from my Stihl dealer that the ONLY thing they can do besides change out the diaphragm is install a NEW CARB because of EPA regs.

Kent
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Old 09-09-2010, 11:48 PM
Bad5.9Cummins00 Bad5.9Cummins00 is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Messed with it a little bit tonight got it to run for about 5 sec then died. I did take carb apart but it still has to be clogged somewhere so ill have to take it apart again and soak in in solution overnight other thing is I get great spark when plug is out but sometimes plug is pretty wet and wouldnt you think if I spray starting fluid in I should be able to keep it running that way right?
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Old 09-10-2010, 09:02 PM
David K David K is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Does the engine have a low oil shutdown feature? Is it low on oil? Don't laugh....I've seen several people do it.

Dave
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Old 09-10-2010, 10:42 PM
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Quote:
Originally Posted by David K View Post
Does the engine have a low oil shutdown feature? Is it low on oil? Don't laugh....I've seen several people do it.

Dave
Yes it does but it has oil ill try adding more I guess a little over filled is ok never thought about it lol Ill be so pissed if that was the problem
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Old 09-10-2010, 10:59 PM
David K David K is offline
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Default Re: Coleman maxa 5000 er wont stay running.

Or just a bad oil level sensor.
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