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Generators & Electric Motors General Discussion

Neutral bond wire


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  #1  
Old 04-05-2019, 11:52:56 AM
opus opus is offline
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Default Neutral bond wire

I have a Honda EB6500 that I need to use on a transfer switch. It trips the generator breaker due to GFCI. I've read many places as well as here and the fix is removing the neutral bond wire:




Would I be wise to do some other sort of grounding when using this only on the transfer switch? Do I need an additional generator to frame ground, etc?

I didnt get this age by being stupid, so I was wanting to double check what I was doing.
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Old 04-05-2019, 06:04:45 PM
Vanman Vanman is online now
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Default Re: Neutral bond wire

Yes, that appears to be bonding jumper in the diagram.

Yes, you do need a grounding conductor in the cable between the generator set frame and the inlet to your transfer switch, also of course with it's ground all the way back to the ground bus in the panel / transfer switch.

If the set is also to be used as stand - alone, the jumper should be reconnected. Some people devise a means of switching it.

Last edited by Vanman; 04-05-2019 at 06:48:52 PM.
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Old 04-05-2019, 07:26:07 PM
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Default Re: Neutral bond wire

I removed the wire and left it hanging on the cover screws as a reminder. Also wrote on the breaker on the generator.
I also checked, there is a wire going from the generator head to the frame.
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Old 04-05-2019, 07:35:34 PM
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Default Re: Neutral bond wire

I have no recent experience with Honda generators as I left that biz like thirty years ago. But here's a thought.

Check around to be sure that by isolating the neutral it won't affect the regulator. I'd hate to see you smoke the regulator and with Honda prices I'm sure it's priced in the stratosphere.
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Old 04-05-2019, 07:39:23 PM
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Default Re: Neutral bond wire

I've not read anything about that, but......
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Old 04-05-2019, 08:20:23 PM
Vanman Vanman is online now
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Default Re: Neutral bond wire

That would be cheesy if that could damage the regulator, but... As long as the set is plugged into the transfer switch inlet, it will be bonded. It won't be able to tell that the bond is remote.
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Old 04-06-2019, 04:54:27 AM
Steve Dawkins Steve Dawkins is offline
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Default Re: Neutral bond wire

At one point, Honda had a "kit" for dealing with the removal of the neutral/ground bonding jumper on their generators with GFCI breakers. The kit consisted of instructions on how to remove the jumper, and a warning label to install on the control panel that stated the bonding jumper had been removed.

When home standby power first got popular in the 80s and 90s, we installed several Gen-Tran manual transfer switches. Most of the customers used them with Honda generators. When the NEC started requiring portable generators of 5 kW and up to have GFCI protection, people started having problems with the generator GFCI tripping as soon as they connected their generator to the Gen-Tran switches. The generator's GFCI "saw" the neutral/ground bond at the main panel as a ground fault condition, and would trip immediately. Once the bonding jumper was removed, that problem went away.

If the generator was going to be used without the Gen-Tran (or other application where the neutral and ground were bonded together downstream of the generator) the jumper should be reinstalled so as to enable GFCI protection. IIRC, we would remove the jumper and attach it externally with one of the end bell screws so that it was a visible reminder to the customer.

As a side note, removing the jumper had no effect on the AVR.
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Old 04-06-2019, 08:26:52 AM
Peter Holmander Peter Holmander is offline
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Default Re: Neutral bond wire

My son in law just went through this with his new Honda EB10000 . He has a new home and it is wired with a generator lockout breaker. He had an older 6000 watt unit that worked fine but he wanted more power. We lost power this past winter so he hooks up his $5000 generator and it keeps tripping on him. Of course, everyone is out so he can't call the place where he bought the unit. The next day when power was restored, I google the issue and I get a ton of hits on the bonded neutral issue. He calls the dealership and they say, "Oh yeah, we forgot to disconnect that for you" The service tech sent him pics on his cell showing what wire to remove. We taped it up really good and reinstalled the access cover. Works fine now. I honestly think the dealer just did not want to disconnect that wire due to liability issues. Now he has to change the breaker from 30 amp to 50 amp. At least he can use the generator now. I was told that Honda does that because so many of their units are used on construction sites.
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