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Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying


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  #1  
Old 01-03-2017, 06:24:48 PM
flippper00 flippper00 is offline
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Default Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying

This Wisconsin engine Master Vibrator Co. generator has what looks to be an AB engine, I think, and could use some help identifying it.

It was complete and original, not seized, has spark, and compression.

It has a Bendix Stromberg carburetor (1/2 P-23566 stamped on bottom), block marked AA-81-K, with a FM-J1 B7 magneto.

Generator head has a rusted nameplate, and box with a 0-150V Voltmeter and a rehostat knob on the gen head with just the manufacturer name visible, Master Vibrator Co.

Haven't tried to start it yet. First, it will get a new gasket set, and carb cleaning, and sump area cleaned, minimally. Later it might be stripped and painted black if I'm ambitious and it runs well.

Which engine is this? AB? Build year?

Any ideas on the generator head: model, watts, volts, current? Google doesn't return much information.

Thanks.
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  #2  
Old 01-03-2017, 07:11:17 PM
flippper00 flippper00 is offline
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Default Re: Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying

Found a different number on the Bendix Stromberg carb: 25-139, pic attached.

This doesn't match the A-18010 number I expected to find for an AB.
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Old 01-03-2017, 07:34:24 PM
Zira Zira is offline
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Default Re: Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying

Certainly appears to be an AB, with the small starter pulley. Could also be an AA but they are much less common. Pull the head if you really need to know.
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Old 01-03-2017, 08:04:27 PM
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Default Re: Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying

Thanks for the answer.

I popped the head, and it is a 2 1/2" bore and 2 3/4" stroke, so AB, right?

Any clues here if it is an early or late production AB (1936-1949)?
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Old 01-03-2017, 08:22:18 PM
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Default Re: Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying

Doh! Found the AB-76 E (or is it an F?) stamp on the bottom of the cylinder head.
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Old 01-05-2017, 12:45:53 AM
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Default Re: Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying

The shroud was put in a 12V electrolysis bath for a few hours, rotated and cooked evenly

After some light scotch-brite, the serial and model stamps appeared faintly. Bore stroke is partially visible.

It is a Model ABS with an AB/ABN 25-139 carb, running at 1800 RPM for a 1KW genset, January 1945 production. Looks like ABS peak power is @3200 RPM, so I wonder if this was unused war production engines fitted to whatever post-war products?
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Old 01-11-2017, 08:47:21 PM
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Default Re: Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying

Got 'er running, cold start video on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wU9yW0FZaCY. Though I suspect some crickets are chirping all over this thread.

The generator itself appears to only put out power with a load attached, and got that working today after some slip ring cleaning and patching a few frayed wires.
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Old 01-11-2017, 10:09:16 PM
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Default Re: Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying

The "Master Vibrator" name leads me to suspect this generator was purpose made to run concrete vibrators. Those are usually 180 cycle. Try putting a frequency meter on the old girl to see what you get.
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Old 01-11-2017, 10:32:31 PM
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Default Re: Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying

From what I have seen, the Master Vibrator 180 cycle machines are three phase, six pole generators running at 3600 rpm to deliver 180 cycles. I have a belt driven one that's pretty cool. I think they made "regular" generators as well.

This one sounds like it's running 1800 rpm, so am guessing he lucked out and it's a four pole machine, generating 60 cycles. If so, very nice!

On the other hand, it's always possible that the governor has been tampered with....

Keith
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Old 01-11-2017, 10:56:17 PM
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Default Re: Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying

This is definitely an 1800 RPM 60 HZ single phase 120 volt generator - got the gen head producing power today with a Kill A Watt attached. There is an old thread on a similar 2KW unit for 60 HZ single phase AC here, same manufacturer - https://www.smokstak.com/forum/showthread.php?t=71849. That thread was very helpful diagnosing the AC power issues. It seems this gen head needs a resistive load (60W incadescent bulb) to start producing volts.

My unit is the same as this one I found on YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ac7W8vqR8vA
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Old 01-12-2017, 01:47:45 AM
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Default Re: Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanman View Post
From what I have seen, the Master Vibrator 180 cycle machines are three phase, six pole generators running at 3600 rpm to deliver 180 cycles. I have a belt driven one that's pretty cool. I think they made "regular" generators as well.

This one sounds like it's running 1800 rpm, so am guessing he lucked out and it's a four pole machine, generating 60 cycles. If so, very nice!

On the other hand, it's always possible that the governor has been tampered with....

Keith
Yes, I tampered with the governor, re-centered the ranges, etc. while it was apart for cleaning, but this is an 1800 RPM generator. Governor changes now allows the old ABS engine to get up to its redline of 3800 RPM, and wow that old engine purrs at that speed. But what a beast of an engine for a small 2 HP load demand (1000 watts)! Way over-built for a simple home generator.

It seems these 4 pole 1800 RPM generators are rare. After refurbishing a few early 70's Briggs and Tecumseh 3600 RPM generators, I wanted an older 1800 RPM gennie. But one downside is that a one cylinder 4-stroke engine at 1800 RPM will only have 900 power strokes/min, or 15/sec, which means that 1 in 4 cycles of AC will be accelerating with a higher voltage, while 3 are decelerating with lowering voltage. So, the incandescent lights flicker a bit at 1/4 of the 60Hz. The house bank charger won't mind the noisy power.
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Old 01-14-2017, 01:05:18 AM
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Default Re: Wisconsin AB on Master Vibrator Co. genset, help needed identifying

Brushes, so delicate, even their chemistry.

Made the mistake of running a towel sprayed with contact cleaner across the slip rings while the slip ring brushes were contacted. This took the AC resistance measurement from 3-4 ohms to over 150 ohms, and I lost AC power. All this after load testing just fine at 800W for an hour yesterday.

Resistance is all back to < 4 ohms now with a bit of 800 grit to remove the caked on film from the brushes.

But I continue to get black streaking on one of the AC side slip ring brushes (even before the contact cleaner debacle).

Is it possible the lubricant is just breaking down in the 72 year-old brush itself? Both are the original Master brush, 60086 I believe.

Both slip rings have been completely cleaned 4 times now with scotch-brite and yet the black streaks and increased resistance in spot returns in a just a few minutes of running. I've even used contact cleaner and 800 grit and had those slip rings shining bright. Mostly just one of them gums up the ring all the way around, and has no rough pitted areas, the other has slight streaking.

I'm new to these old gennies, so help for this newbie is much appreciated.

Where's a good source for new 3/16" x 1/2" x 7/8?" brushes with a spring over wire configuration?

Thanks.
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