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Computer, Camera and ISP Problems

General Squawking About Windows Update


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  #1  
Old 09-10-2016, 11:57:15 PM
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Default General Squawking About Windows Update

I'm running Windows 7 on the desktop here. Due to the need of keeping Smokstak and Enginads running, I keep a Pro Service Contract from Dell on the system.

Windows Update has not been working properly for the past couple of months. Finally, it quit altogether, acting like it was checking for or downloading updates, but it wasn't doing anything of the kind.

I was on the phone for most of the afternoon with Dell Pro support and then they decided to get Microsoft in on the act. What a joke and pure torture! First, they were talking $400 for service and then Dell got them to do it at no cost. I had to get a ticket opened up and then came up against talking with someone in the Philippines or equivalent. My ears are old and they talk fast with mush in their mouth. It's hopeless! When they say my name, it's HarrrrEEee! That's ok, but everything else is goofed up too. I guess it's better than India English.

Anyway, through the magic of remote command they tried a few things (in addition to all the crap that Dell tried) and got it to downloading again, but that was short lived and I'm right back to where I started before. At least I still have the Microsoft ticket number.

Looks like this has been going on for a while: https://www.google.com/search?q=wind...utf-8&oe=utf-8 It's amazing how many EXPURTZ can get a web page up about the same thing with different answers.

Truth is that Microsoft wants us all on Windows 10 so they can deliver ads on all of our pages. Makes me really thoughtful about buying another Windoze computer!
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  #2  
Old 09-11-2016, 12:39:16 AM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

I feel your pain from experience Harry.
I'm not sure now many WIN 10 upgrades and installs I've done but enough to know what's what.
Due to slow internet connections for others I downloaded the offline ISO installer and wrote it to a DVD which worked fine as long as whatever version hadn't been removed.
On one of my own computers it became necessary to wipe the hdd and start from nothing and the install went fine.
I went to validate WIN 10 after the install with no problem after I explained what happened to a real person in North America no less....... who issued a new validation code on the spot in less than 5 minutes.
At our Village Office I upgraded two machines as well.
One upgrade and one clean install both of which went smoothly and both validated "themselves" without a hitch.
Enter my favorite, old fashioned, service station whose computer got hit with ransom ware (as did my churche's office) so these were also clean installs from similarly reformatted hdds.
The churches went fine but I never did get the service station validated despite at least an hours worth of calls to MS saying they had fixed it........they hadn't.......
That machine has been running fine for a couple months, or more, so I'm not arguing with success.
If they're happy I'm happy.
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Old 09-11-2016, 09:02:46 AM
Orgwayne Orgwayne is offline
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

I got a real nice Apple from my son , boy no more updates every day from Microsoft, I do not miss it one bit
Wayne
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Old 09-11-2016, 11:53:11 AM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

As far as I'm concerned Microjunk has cooked it's Goose with me.

After 5 Gigs of overage charges in the week I used Windows 10 I believe Microjunk updates are slowing down the Entire internet Why get constant updates on Useless Apps I didn't want anyway.

Now they are adding Spam Links to my Private E-Mails on my MSN account

It cost my over 130 $ to get a new Windows 10 computer usable. When Windows 7 is done so am I.

Something is Radically Wrong when you can buy a 79 $ tablet from Shopco with a No Name operating system and it's usable when Windows 10 is Not.
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Old 09-11-2016, 11:58:47 AM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

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Originally Posted by Orgwayne View Post
I got a real nice Apple from my son , boy no more updates every day from Microsoft, I do not miss it one bit
Wayne
Unless I am totally incorrect Apple computers check in with mama every time they are turned on it's just not advertised the way windows does it. I am running a Linux system and it updates something about every two days.
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Old 09-11-2016, 01:44:19 PM
Archaeometrist Archaeometrist is offline
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

My Linux system checks for security updates on a daily basis, and all others on a weekly basis - because of the things I do. I've locked out the latest upgrade, because the last upgrade (Ubuntu) broke a lot of the specialized software that I use on a regular basis - and I hate the Unity desktop (which I had to block out) and don't want to go through all that again. Once I've finished my research, then maybe I'll upgrade - but because I despise Unity, I may go to another flavor.

I'd gone to Ubuntu/OpenOffice because Office kept scrambling my MA thesis - and I couldn't get it to stop (plus an upgrade to player went through my computer and deleted some videos I'd taken - told me I didn't have the rights to my own home videos!). Microsoft nearly cost me my degree because it kept insisting on formatting portions of it a certain way, and we couldn't find a way to get it to stop. That ended the use of their products.

My wife and I won't touch 10. The issues with it are too severe and too many - and we can't stand using it. Her work-at-home job requires that she have a secure computer and that means no reporting to Microsoft (or anyone else). We also need to do our own work on our own systems - and administrator has been pared back to a little more than generic user.
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Old 09-11-2016, 02:11:55 PM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

And I'm still running my 2005 XP box. Yeah it's getting old but it just keeps chugging along with 30,000 + hours on it.
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Old 09-11-2016, 06:55:09 PM
Harvey Teal Harvey Teal is offline
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

I'm still running critical programs on XP, and have adopted 7 as an alternative "stable" platforms. Getting all kinds of obnoxious messages from MS literally threatening me to upgrade to 10. My son advises not to upgrade to 10, but to simply buy a new machine with 10 preinstalled in order to avoid the cost and aggravation of upgrading. I'm seriously considering burning all of this sh*t in my back yard and going back to typewriter & slide rule.
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Old 09-11-2016, 08:35:52 PM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

We can not change from XP at work as our accounting program will not work with the newer programs. To change program it would cost a fortune.
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Old 09-12-2016, 12:05:31 AM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

Having great fun here! Realized that back in 2011, I had installed drive#1 and had made a drive to drive copy of drive #0 including the boot tracks. Flipped the cables on the two drives and turned it on and it came up as though it was 2011.

Trend Micro was back, Avast was gone and Windows Update worked EXCELLENTLY! Got Trend Micro uninstalled, Avast reinstalled and went to work updating the Windows system.

BANG! Windows decided that it was corrupt and reverted the system back to an even earlier time. Trend was back and Avast was scrapped. The updates were gone. O.M.G. Then while moving drives and drive cables (four of them) around, I must have hit the lever that holds the second processor and its memory bank in place. BANG again - no POST (power on self test.)

Gave up, took a break, wife shopping, out to dinner. Came back at it and Googled the POST leds and it gave me a clue. Googled the clue and saw posts from guys that had hit that lever.

Changed the CMOS battery while I had the box open and seated the lever that holds the second processor bank and up and running again. Now I'm back on the original boot drive with the original Windows Update problem. UUUGGGHHHHH!

6GB RAM 800 Mhz
6 channels
Two E5506 processors at 2.13 GHz, eight cores, with four 7200 mr.p.m. drives plus DVD.
Probably not a screamer by today's standards, but it has worked for me since 2009.

Having fun in Florida on a crowded desk!
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Old 09-12-2016, 02:07:38 AM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

I see your problem.
Too many fans causing excessive turbulence combined with unterminated SATA cables causing excessive RF leakage.
73
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Old 09-12-2016, 07:46:40 AM
steve mallette steve mallette is offline
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

Quote:
Originally Posted by Archaeometrist View Post
My Linux system checks for security updates on a daily basis, and all others on a weekly basis - because of the things I do. I've locked out the latest upgrade, because the last upgrade (Ubuntu) broke a lot of the specialized software that I use on a regular basis - and I hate the Unity desktop (which I had to block out) and don't want to go through all that again. Once I've finished my research, then maybe I'll upgrade - but because I despise Unity, I may go to another flavor.

I'd gone to Ubuntu/OpenOffice because Office kept scrambling my MA thesis - and I couldn't get it to stop (plus an upgrade to player went through my computer and deleted some videos I'd taken - told me I didn't have the rights to my own home videos!). Microsoft nearly cost me my degree because it kept insisting on formatting portions of it a certain way, and we couldn't find a way to get it to stop. That ended the use of their products.

My wife and I won't touch 10. The issues with it are too severe and too many - and we can't stand using it. Her work-at-home job requires that she have a secure computer and that means no reporting to Microsoft (or anyone else). We also need to do our own work on our own systems - and administrator has been pared back to a little more than generic user.
I'm with you ... I've used linux of a couple three "flavors" and after a while learning to drive them I would never go back to MICROSHAFT...
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Old 09-12-2016, 08:47:44 AM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

Quote:
Originally Posted by Power View Post
I see your problem.
Too many fans causing excessive turbulence combined with unterminated SATA cables causing excessive RF leakage.
73
The pulled SATA cables are from my troubleshooting. The system was manufactured with the spare cables installed (blue) and in fact, one was unterminated. This box always creates a bunch of heat, but the fans are generally loafing. The fans are all speed controlled based upon temperature.

I have the system all working fine now EXCEPT for "Windows Update." Microsoft is scheduled to call me this afternoon for additional work on WU.

Once this dust settles, I will have two .5 TB drives and two 1 TB drives, all 7200 r.p.m. I'm hoping this thing will hold up for a few more years. I will most likely need to cave in, get Windoze 10 and neuter it based upon web instructions.

It's amazing to see how many users have issues with Windows Update! Might be that MS is forcing us into the 10 corral.
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Old 09-12-2016, 11:01:50 AM
Archaeometrist Archaeometrist is offline
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

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Might be that MS is forcing us into the 10 corral.
That's exactly what it sounds like. While helping my wife with her system, I did some digging regarding updates. What I learned was not pretty. A half dozen of them or so are toxic as hell, and the others - only install them if they fix a problem, otherwise don't install them even if Microsoft pushes you.

Most of the security updates are to protect Microsoft profits - to try to prevent people from pirating their software. (It is a big problem - but they also try to make older versions no longer usable.) Indeed, there was a huge stink a few years ago because there were a really severe exploit that Microsoft knew about but didn't want to bother with - which opened the door to some really nasty viruses. They were patching to protect themselves but forget their customers. (I remember when that came out quite well.)

I also remember well when W95 came out - and was written to trash OS/2 if you had it on your system. Programmers figured out a way to get around that pretty fast, but I ran OS/2 and had that happen to me. Microsoft didn't want OS/2 dual booted on the system - OS/2 was more powerful than XP, but out back before W3.1! (It would run multiple different programs simultaneously in a single desktop on a 4mb -8mb 486 computer - I used to do that to blow people's mind!) Microsoft has a LONG history of... corporate greed and crookedness.

This is the important point: Several of the non-security updates were specifically crafted to try to trick or force people to go to 10, and they were installing the spyware built into 10 onto older versions of windows. One of those "updates" even had it so that if you "x"ed out of the update window (trying to NOT update the system), doing so was considered approval of the update and it would start against your wishes. Microsoft was also downloading 10 onto your system via a couple of those updates, and one update even stopped the boot process and you had to accept/reject upgrading to 10 before the boot continued. Another bad thing I learned was that some of those non-security updates would crash certain computers. Most of those toxic updates were considered beyond the legal boundaries of running a business and were outright deceptive and dishonest.

Then there is this whole "secure boot" BS. I run oddball software and hardware here - and some of it is not "Microsoft-approved" (plus some of my equipment uses a serial port and I even have stuff out back that runs with a parallel port). Basically it works out to be another way to push people into buying whatever Microsoft wants them to buy... and "secure boot" has caused some headaches for Linux users (it's part of the firmware of the computer). I have to keep it turned off, even in Linux because otherwise some of my stuff won't run.

Finally, one thing about 10 and some of these updates is that they'll break older versions of certain (expensive) software packages, forcing you to buy the latest and greatest even if you're happy with what you had. Xp SP3 did that with several packages (I think Microsoft was sued in another country for that stunt and lost). I have a couple of those programs here - and a virtual machine with Xp SP2 installed (with updates locked out) because of that little stunt.
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Old 09-12-2016, 11:53:33 AM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

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Originally Posted by RobW View Post
Unless I am totally incorrect Apple computers check in with mama every time they are turned on it's just not advertised the way windows does it. I am running a Linux system and it updates something about every two days.
You are correct. They phone home to the land of Steve Jobs every time they turn on. In my opinion the two differences between OSX (Apple) and Windows is that Apple focuses so much on integrated hardware & software so you don't experience the "slowness" that Windows does, or at least not nearly as quickly. Second big difference is that OSX is very Unix based so many traditional *nix things are native in OSX vs. Windows.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DCamp View Post
We can not change from XP at work as our accounting program will not work with the newer programs. To change program it would cost a fortune.
May be more effort than its worth but starting with W7 MSFT introduced an "XP Mode" that is reverse compatible with just about all XP applications. Going forward to 8/8.1 MSFT included Hyper-V which allows you to run a virtual machine inside your newer OS. There are ways to upgrade to newer OS. XP in a business environment is a little scary these days, especially for financial software.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry View Post
Now I'm back on the original boot drive with the original Windows Update problem. UUUGGGHHHHH!
That looks like a T7500? I have a couple T5500's and T7500's. Your numbering is a little off on your SATA cables. It may be correct relative to the drives & SATA ports, but if you look closely on the metal cross bar below the drives, you will see top left is marked 0, bottom left is marked 1, top right is marked 2 and bottom right is marked 3. Not that it matters, I just have OCD. One of the nice things about those Dell systems is that the COA (license activation key) is embedded in the BIOS so as long as you have the Dell media (CD/DVD) you can format & reinstall the OS as many times as you want. When I get new Precision Workstations in that are pre-imaged from Dell, the first thing I do is nuke (format) them and reinstall the OS. They put so much bloatware and junk on them that even with dual CPU and a decent amount of RAM they get very slow. You also have a built in LSI raid controller on that machine so you shouldn't need to copy drives manually, they will either mirror or RAID on their own, if you want them to. Also, I believe that those machines only shipped with Professional and Enterprise editions of Windows. You should have a lot more options in terms of updates than home/retail users do. If you go into control panel, windows update, you can tell it (left column, "change settings") to "never check for updates".
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Old 09-12-2016, 01:37:27 PM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

Harry, all kidding aside, I do not have a lot of experience with servers.

The few that I worked on ran a version of Linux.
I did not set systems up, just diagnose and repair hardware when they went down.

Some installations, including colleges are using Linux servers with staff and students running Microsoft desktops, laptops.

Have you considered Linux? No license fees or Micros**t BS. Kernel is clean, uses fewer resources, should extend the life of your server, just vacuum out the dust every year or so.
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Old 09-14-2016, 03:30:34 PM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

Our Smokstak server runs on Linux. I only know what I need to know and that is: "If it ain't broke, I don't fix it." I lease the server and the maintenance is included.

As for my notebook Windows Update, it sets on this screen all day and does nothing! Two systems with the same problem. No concern for firewall or internet connection - I installed a new hard drive, installed Windows and Avast, and Windows Update works perfectly! I'd like to get the original drive working as all my software is installed on that drive.

It's like MS is messing with us to force us into Windows 10!

GOOGLE IT - ten pages of internet buzz solving nothing.
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Old 09-14-2016, 03:37:28 PM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

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Originally Posted by 1215 View Post
It may be correct relative to the drives & SATA ports, but if you look closely on the metal cross bar below the drives, you will see top left is marked 0, bottom left is marked 1, top right is marked 2 and bottom right is marked 3.
The metal bar labels have #3 on top, #2 bottom on left AND #1 on top, #0 bottom on right as per the previous photo. T7500, dual processor, eight core.
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Old 09-14-2016, 06:29:08 PM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

I just finished updating my wife's laptop (windows 7)... it had sat unused for about six months. I had all sorts of problems with it sitting there with a "searching for updates" message. I'd run into a couple of comments about just leaving it to search for a long time... more than 24 hours, when this happened before. So I let it sit there and do its thing. 30 hours after that, it finally stopped searching and had a list of 39 updates (10 of them questionable). I had it do the security updates, and will check the other 10 to see if any of them are the bad ones.


(When I first acquired it - given to us when someone else upgraded to a new laptop, it required all of the updates up to when we got it. It took - as I remember - almost two full days to finish searching, and several hours to download all of the "security" updates and install them.)

It's been downloading and applying updates for a couple of hours now, and still isn't finished.
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Old 09-16-2016, 03:25:34 PM
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Default Re: General Squawking About Windows Update

After three different Microsoft technicians (in the Philippines) being remotely logged in and working on my desktop for a total of 4 hours each on three different days, they have told me that it is time to re-install Windows. I really don't think they know what the hell they are doing. In fact, they admitted that Microsoft knows there is a bug in Windows Update.

I suspect that this bug came in with my updating to Windows 10 during the promotion period and then my reverting back to Windows 7. In a word, Windows 10 sucks, but they want EVERYONE to switch over to it. It appears that Windows 7 is totally off the market!

I'm left to follow my own pathway by installing a new hard drive, installing Windows 7 from a recovery disk and building the system up from there with my software and utilities. What a waste of time!
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