Antique Engines and Old Iron
[Home] - [HELP] - [Forums] - [Library] - [Photo Gallery] - [Groups] - [Classified Ads] - [Subscribe] - [Links] - [Books] - [Sponsors] -

Go Back   SmokStak > SmokStak® Old Iron and Tractor Community > Horse Drawn Equipment
Forgot Password? Join Us!

Notices

Horse Drawn Equipment Old iron designed for the purpose of hitching up to a horse or a team. This old iron machinery may be used or demonstrated while hooked to an old iron tractor too.

Horse Drawn Equipment

The French Amsterdammer, The Horsesleigh from the Golden Age 1682


this thread has 36 replies and has been viewed 1570 times

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 12-03-2016, 08:32:59 AM
Brothers Clemens's Avatar
Brothers Clemens Brothers Clemens is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Haarlemmermeer, Lisserbroek, Netherlands
Posts: 6,412
Thanks: 13,321
Thanked 18,869 Times in 4,321 Posts
Default Re: The French Amsterdammer, The Horsesleigh from the Golden Age 1682

Ok going further,

The next 2 Amsterdammer horse sleighs are an mixture and coming close to the model of the wreckage of the horse sleigh we found in France from that old castle.

The bow statue Amsterdammer horse sleigh,

On the next 3 pictures we can see an bow statue Amsterdammer horse sleigh.

This sleigh dates begin until half 18 century and is possetion of the National Dutch carriage and sleigh collection at Leek and the Horse and Carros collection.


I only ever have seen 2 real bow statue Amsterdammers.

The first is this one on the pictures with somekind of thin sceleton frame under the sleigh.
On the front there is Diana sitting.
Diana is the ancient female god of the hunters or the hunting season.







Now here is the other bow statue Amsterdammer.

I already have been posted another thread on Smokstak about this sleigh.
The sleigh is to see on an very old painting cart picture and taken in the second part of the golden age 1650/1702 on the golden bend/Gentemen street/Herengracht in the center of the old Amsterdam.

Now i have study with Jaap after the thread was post this picture.
Jaap told that the bowstatue on that Amsterdammer is not Diane but an nobelian male stagecoach figure from the 17 century.

So they made different figures as bow statues on the early Amsterdammers.

https://www.smokstak.com/forum/showthread.php?t=159062


The Golden age Amsterdammer horse sleigh was not design for Royal family’s of Europe.
It was only made and design for the most rich /nobelian people of Amsterdam in the golden age.
That ones that where owners of the fleet of ships called VOC Dutch East and West Indies.



Dutch historian Geert Mak wrote and once told.

Amsterdam was the 17 century the prosper golden city full with flooting (and lot water arround) houses as palaces in the Europe while the rest was still an lot hidding in the middle ages.

Next we are going to watch towards one of the oldest sleigh survivors of Europe.
The Amsterdammer horse sleigh from 1682.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	004.jpg
Views:	17
Size:	71.6 KB
ID:	269332   Click image for larger version

Name:	151.jpg
Views:	16
Size:	89.3 KB
ID:	269333   Click image for larger version

Name:	152.jpg
Views:	16
Size:	93.4 KB
ID:	269334  
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Brothers Clemens For This Post:
Sponsored Links
  #12  
Old 12-04-2016, 06:33:09 AM
Brothers Clemens's Avatar
Brothers Clemens Brothers Clemens is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Haarlemmermeer, Lisserbroek, Netherlands
Posts: 6,412
Thanks: 13,321
Thanked 18,869 Times in 4,321 Posts
Default Re: The French Amsterdammer, The Horsesleigh from the Golden Age 1682

Oldest styled Horse Sleigh of Europe the 1682 Amsterdammer,


Ok here you all can see the oldest styled horse sleigh of Europe...

An big thank posting for picture 3 and source of the catalog of National horse carriage and sleigh collection at Leek and the Dutch foundation Horse and Caros.

Posting this picture as evidence in the sleigh that we have found and soon going to post here.

This sleigh must have been restored looking at the stumblin condition.

Now the sleigh that we have found is having marks from the sceleton frame and bow statue sleigh chapter 11 and the under leggs towards the gilders on this sleigh are on the sleigh chapter 12 (this chapter).

There is also something more to notice.
The sleigh in the glass showcase at the Versalles is having the same under leggs as the oldest in Holland and the wrekage we found.
Going to find out in the future how old that one wil be ?.



About the Griffon bow statue on the wreckage sleigh that we found in France,

The Griffon is an very old ancien legendairy creature half Lion and half bird.

The half Lion stands for protection the land

The half bird stands for protection the sky.

It is also an very big warn towards everybody that is coming to close towards the sleigh that the bird lion beast will say hold on there and not come to close or further.
This big ancient beast is standing on the frontbow as an protection towards the sleigh and the people in it.

Now you all start to understand what kind of fabulous big ancient horse sleigh is on his way towards Smokstak next week and Christmas..


Ok until so far the Amsterdammers sleighs that have survived.
I am sure there are an coople more Amsterdammers sleighs that have survived from the arround number of 25 but most importand models you have seen now.


When there is time i wil try to post an coople historical chapters in this story aswel like.

The Old Amsterdam Europe and the New Amsterdam (New York) America.


And an very sad story from the golden age.


We hope arround the end of this week start to upload pictures of the unknown Amsterdammer horse sleigh wreckage that we have found.

Stay tune here with some very intresting chapters going to show up here soon.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Leek.jpg
Views:	15
Size:	99.8 KB
ID:	269400   Click image for larger version

Name:	154.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	130.5 KB
ID:	269401   Click image for larger version

Name:	Scan0164.jpg
Views:	15
Size:	160.9 KB
ID:	269402  
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Brothers Clemens For This Post:
  #13  
Old 12-05-2016, 03:11:22 PM
Brothers Clemens's Avatar
Brothers Clemens Brothers Clemens is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Haarlemmermeer, Lisserbroek, Netherlands
Posts: 6,412
Thanks: 13,321
Thanked 18,869 Times in 4,321 Posts
Default Re: The French Amsterdammer, The Horsesleigh from the Golden Age 1682

The old Amsterdam Holland Europe and New Amsterdam New York America,

Most of you know the story about New Amsterdam later become New York.

I want to pay some attention in this story aswel.

Arround 2 years ago something very intresting showed up near an Antique dealer in the center of New York ! ?.





The first Dutch settlers arrived 1609 /1624 at the riverbanks on the Hudson river what later became as New York.

In the early days this Dutch colony was called New Amsterdam.

It was not only named New Amsterdam but it was also an copy of the real old Amsterdam because.

There where water Chanels and roads in the same figures laying as Amsterdam.
There was an golden bend street with called the same as the Herengracht and there was even an old fashion Dutch windmill....

In the same time as the Dutch golden age.


In the past made some jokes on Smokstak that we trade New Amsterdam for Surinamen with the British.

Wel this is not the truth.

It was years later after we given out New Amsterdam that we coult lay our hands on Suriname.

The story with given off New Amsterdam is that the British and French power was over whelming for the Dutch.

At the moment there is not much to find anymore of the Dutch in New York.

Wel there is something and that is the bend and the lay of the Streets on Manhattan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-UGFyIp6xw&t=283s


Coming back on the begin of this subject.

Now what was showed up near that antique dealer in the center of New York 2 years ago.

It is to see in the picture inside this chapter....


So once 350 years ago they where to find in the New Amsterdam, America aswel the Amsterdammers from the Old Amsterdam of Holland and this was way before the founding fathers and Lewis and Clark......


More to come,
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	019.jpg
Views:	16
Size:	81.0 KB
ID:	269568  
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Brothers Clemens For This Post:
  #14  
Old 12-06-2016, 01:45:30 PM
Brothers Clemens's Avatar
Brothers Clemens Brothers Clemens is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Haarlemmermeer, Lisserbroek, Netherlands
Posts: 6,412
Thanks: 13,321
Thanked 18,869 Times in 4,321 Posts
Default Re: The French Amsterdammer, The Horsesleigh from the Golden Age 1682

Ok and very sad story from the golden age,

It was not all gliter and glamour.
There is always another side of the medalion with these kind things.
Not all the ship owners where traders in stuff and colonial spices
Some realy dit trade humans and slaves.


Like Dutch historian Geert Mak told.

Amsterdam was the golden city of Europe in the 17 century.

This attracted people from all over Europe.

This was also with an girl named Elsje Christaens from Jutland.
She went to Amsterdam to find work in one of the palace houses.


On the end she was killed on an most horrible way.
Wel she dit killed her landlady with an axe.

There is an lot to do about this story.
Some say that her landlady wanted to let her go in to prostitution.
This is why she killed her land lady.

We never realy find out what happened but anybody that is having intrest here is her story with the painting that was made by Rembrandt in an boat when she was hanging on the small Island north of Amsterdam where now the old shell office bulding is standing.


This is one of the most sad story’s from the golden age...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elsje_Christiaens


Until so far all of this.

Now it is time for some happines in this thread.

What is next.

Next in this thread is that we all going to watch to the sleigh wreckage of an Amsterdammer sleigh that we have found in France.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Brothers Clemens For This Post:
  #15  
Old 12-07-2016, 02:54:49 PM
Brothers Clemens's Avatar
Brothers Clemens Brothers Clemens is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Haarlemmermeer, Lisserbroek, Netherlands
Posts: 6,412
Thanks: 13,321
Thanked 18,869 Times in 4,321 Posts
Default Re: The French Amsterdammer, The Horsesleigh from the Golden Age 1682

Yust came home from an very exiting day.......

First we went towards Jaap his sleigh restauration shop drink coffee and study all the sleighs and work.

Have been taken 100 pictures of all of this.

Then we went home but drive further towards the south of Holland after an advertisment and discovered an amazing old treasury in an old cellar under an old House close to Rotterdam.

We have bought an increddible huge item that once been standing in the 19 century in an old big church in Holland.

It was an increddible work this evening to pull it out of this old cellar where it have been standing for more then 40 years under the dust.


Next saturday it will be shipped carreful with an truck towards our farm.

I am going to give you all some pictures of what it is and it will be showed up with Christmas compleet on Smokstak with the message the Angels are on there way..........


This sleigh was found on an castle in France.

Before we start upload the pictures of this sleigh we are going to bring the Smokstakers in the mood with an French song belonged to the amazing item that we found today in that old cellar in Rotterdam and to see in the 2 pictures of this chapter.


Les Marches Des Angles with the message already wish you all an Merry Christmas !,


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KN2O0pqfJHQ







Tomorrow we are going to start upload mountains of pictures of one of the most beautiful horse sleighs of Europe.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	kerst 1.jpg
Views:	20
Size:	58.3 KB
ID:	269694   Click image for larger version

Name:	kerst 5.jpg
Views:	20
Size:	59.9 KB
ID:	269695  

Last edited by Brothers Clemens; 12-07-2016 at 04:18:52 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Brothers Clemens For This Post:
  #16  
Old 12-08-2016, 01:26:19 PM
Brothers Clemens's Avatar
Brothers Clemens Brothers Clemens is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Haarlemmermeer, Lisserbroek, Netherlands
Posts: 6,412
Thanks: 13,321
Thanked 18,869 Times in 4,321 Posts
Default Re: The French Amsterdammer, The Horsesleigh from the Golden Age 1682

The French Amsterdammer Horsesleigh,


Ok we are going to start up with some lines of pictures of the Amsterdammer that we found in France.

The sleigh is an wreckage and lay compleet out of each others.

To watch the sleigh we are going to bring it in with parts and chapters.


The First chapter wil be the fragile under section.

We are going to start up with small pictures taken an coople weeks ago when Jaap placed the undersection an little bit in each other.


Undersection,

It is not only and sleigh from the golden age but the sleigh wil be gold aswel and wil be called in our collection as the Golden Sleigh.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	am 6.jpg
Views:	15
Size:	63.5 KB
ID:	269753   Click image for larger version

Name:	am 19.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	45.1 KB
ID:	269754   Click image for larger version

Name:	am.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	84.3 KB
ID:	269755   Click image for larger version

Name:	am1.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	85.3 KB
ID:	269756  

Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Brothers Clemens For This Post:
  #17  
Old 12-08-2016, 01:32:34 PM
Brothers Clemens's Avatar
Brothers Clemens Brothers Clemens is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Haarlemmermeer, Lisserbroek, Netherlands
Posts: 6,412
Thanks: 13,321
Thanked 18,869 Times in 4,321 Posts
Default Re: The French Amsterdammer, The Horsesleigh from the Golden Age 1682

Undersection 2

Here are more pictures coming up.

Very carefully the undersection placed in each other.

On the first hand the frame work is coming the closed to the Diane sleigh in post 11 with the sceleton frame.

Wel it is an sceleton frame but with the woodwork from sleigh post 12.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	am2.jpg
Views:	14
Size:	98.6 KB
ID:	269757   Click image for larger version

Name:	am3.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	72.6 KB
ID:	269758   Click image for larger version

Name:	am4.jpg
Views:	15
Size:	68.6 KB
ID:	269759   Click image for larger version

Name:	am5.jpg
Views:	12
Size:	85.6 KB
ID:	269760  

Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Brothers Clemens For This Post:
  #18  
Old 12-08-2016, 01:37:02 PM
Brothers Clemens's Avatar
Brothers Clemens Brothers Clemens is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Haarlemmermeer, Lisserbroek, Netherlands
Posts: 6,412
Thanks: 13,321
Thanked 18,869 Times in 4,321 Posts
Default Re: The French Amsterdammer, The Horsesleigh from the Golden Age 1682

Undersection 3,

Now here are the first marks that we are dealing with an Amsterdammer Horse Sleigh specialy in picture 1 because there you can see the special ancient bend S iron that is going from the back under the main seat towards the gliders.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	am7.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	69.0 KB
ID:	269761   Click image for larger version

Name:	am8.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	57.4 KB
ID:	269762   Click image for larger version

Name:	am9.jpg
Views:	12
Size:	51.6 KB
ID:	269763   Click image for larger version

Name:	am10.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	36.5 KB
ID:	269764  

Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Brothers Clemens For This Post:
  #19  
Old 12-08-2016, 01:40:53 PM
Brothers Clemens's Avatar
Brothers Clemens Brothers Clemens is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Haarlemmermeer, Lisserbroek, Netherlands
Posts: 6,412
Thanks: 13,321
Thanked 18,869 Times in 4,321 Posts
Default Re: The French Amsterdammer, The Horsesleigh from the Golden Age 1682

Undersection 4,

More images of the undersection.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	am11.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	78.3 KB
ID:	269767   Click image for larger version

Name:	am14.jpg
Views:	12
Size:	78.7 KB
ID:	269770   Click image for larger version

Name:	am15.jpg
Views:	12
Size:	90.7 KB
ID:	269771   Click image for larger version

Name:	am16.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	68.5 KB
ID:	269772  

Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Brothers Clemens For This Post:
  #20  
Old 12-08-2016, 01:50:38 PM
Brothers Clemens's Avatar
Brothers Clemens Brothers Clemens is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Haarlemmermeer, Lisserbroek, Netherlands
Posts: 6,412
Thanks: 13,321
Thanked 18,869 Times in 4,321 Posts
Default Re: The French Amsterdammer, The Horsesleigh from the Golden Age 1682

Undersection 5,

Now take an very good look at pictures 1, 2 and 3.
After study the leave, flower wood cutting work then go towards chapter 12 of this thread and watch the leggs of the Amsterdammer that was made in 1682.
Almost execly the same way of wood cut work.....and the same as the sleigh in the Versailles in the glass showcase....




Tomorrow we are going to study the midsection then later days the upper section and then further the big bowstatue....
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	am13.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	51.8 KB
ID:	269773   Click image for larger version

Name:	am21.jpg
Views:	11
Size:	51.9 KB
ID:	269774   Click image for larger version

Name:	am22.jpg
Views:	13
Size:	52.3 KB
ID:	269775   Click image for larger version

Name:	am17.jpg
Views:	11
Size:	89.0 KB
ID:	269776  

Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Brothers Clemens For This Post:
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

F o r u m Jump

Similar Threads Chosen at Random
Thread Thread Starter F o r u m Replies Last Post
Two Old French Postcards from an old French Engine factory Brothers Clemens Antique Gas Engine Discussion 5 08-26-2012 03:50:43 PM
French Mag help Sad Iron Magnetos, Ignition Coils and Spark Plugs 2 11-23-2011 09:21:41 AM
Golden Rod ~Wittes-End~ Antique Gas Engine Discussion 4 11-14-2006 01:24:03 PM
golden arrow ?? Allen L Fry Antique Engine Archives 0 02-02-2002 03:43:10 AM


Use "Ctrl" mouse wheel to change screen size.
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:26:08 AM.

Smokstak and Enginads site search!


All use is subject to our TERMS OF SERVICE
SMOKSTAK® is a Registered Trade Mark - A Community of Antique Engine Enthusiasts
Copyright © 2000 - 2016 by Harry Matthews P.O. Box 5612 - Sarasota, FL 34277