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Tractors in December!


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  #21  
Old 12-16-2015, 09:43:17 AM
David Hoover David Hoover is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

Hmmmm, it's gotta be real then, it'll turn up someplace .
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Old 12-16-2015, 07:00:56 PM
G Willikers G Willikers is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

I took some pix today. It's tight quarters so we'll see how they look. Showing some here of the two belt pulleys. This appears to be factory as the main shaft through the bevel gear case would be a very tough thing to "farmer fix" or blacksmith. It either came out of the factory with the extended shaft and dual pulleys or was retrofitted by Sawyer-Massey. The pulleys are identical and Sawyer-Massey 'G' parts numbers. A neat set up. Note the gears!
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  #23  
Old 12-16-2015, 08:19:17 PM
casertractor casertractor is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

Do you guys have a year on this tractor ?.John
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  #24  
Old 12-16-2015, 08:37:47 PM
halcon halcon is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

I worked on a Sawyer Massey at Crosby that didn't appear as tho it had ever had a clutch brake. Where the early ones not so equipped ??
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Old 12-16-2015, 08:40:14 PM
G Willikers G Willikers is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

John,
I did hear a guesstimate on the year; but forget now. You can see the serial number plate, number 4586. The only other 4-stacker we have seen is #5301, restored by the late Lorne Harris of Dresden, Ontario and now in Illinois. That is quite a spread in numbers. That tractor sat in a gravel pit south of Stratford for many years.
Here is a picture of the original plate for the canopy where the stacks went through. It survived the roof collapse very well. We cut some new steel for the canopy today and laid it outside to "season" a bit. We are saving all the braces for reuse. The side boards are also planed so ESG can do the artwork.
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Old 12-16-2015, 08:51:51 PM
G Willikers G Willikers is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

Quote:
Originally Posted by halcon View Post
I worked on a Sawyer Massey at Crosby that didn't appear as tho it had ever had a clutch brake. Where the early ones not so equipped ??
Mr. Halcon,
Was able to find my brochure on the bigger tractors. It doesn't show a brake on pulley. The 20-40 here has the pulley brake as well as one on the intermediate gear.
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Old 12-17-2015, 09:50:31 AM
David Hoover David Hoover is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

The early tractors had no pulley brake, all there was was the wood dowels on the clutch brake on the front if the transfer case. There's one here with a pulley brake and one without and yes the pulley brake is an improvement !
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Old 12-17-2015, 05:55:10 PM
David Hoover David Hoover is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

Quote:
Originally Posted by G Willikers View Post
Mr. Halcon,
Was able to find my brochure on the bigger tractors. It doesn't show a brake on pulley. The 20-40 here has the pulley brake as well as one on the intermediate gear.
That's the same as a 1911 machine, they had no belt tensioner on the fan either. I think they were in such a rush to get the first ones out the door that they missed a lot of helpful pieces .
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  #29  
Old 12-17-2015, 07:19:18 PM
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Sawyer-Massey 11-22 Sawyer-Massey 11-22 is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

Onkle G, if you talk really nicely to them lads in Ancaster, you may be able to borrow the fuel screen on the 11-22, and have one cast. Lorne cast it off of the cast iron one on his 20-40, but out of bronze. It has the Sawyer casting # on it.

R
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Old 12-17-2015, 10:35:34 PM
G Willikers G Willikers is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

R.
Those Ancaster lads respond nicely to sweets!
Here are some more pix of the 20-40. The Detroit lubricator still has original lettering and pin striping. we have asked before, but does anyone know where to find the sight glass assemblies for the top? This is a 10 feed.
Also wanted to show the starter! Note anti roll back dog on the right of flywheel. And last picture shows a bit of the old fancy work.
We pulled off the bearing caps on the steering shaft today to do some repairs. There is what appears to be original colour on there. Looks like a possible red oxide or red lead undercoat with an overcoat of a glossy sort of dark, perhaps charcoal - not jet black. We are finding that elsewhere. Has anyone else heard of Sawyer-Massey using that colour? Yet, a lot of the frame appears to have been red. The lubricator is a dark green.
Merci beaucoup.
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  #31  
Old 12-18-2015, 12:39:46 AM
David Hoover David Hoover is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

Good pictures, there's a 1911 25-45 here that's originally painted grey, never had a pulley brake, or fan belt tensioner, and the kick back dog was only mounted to the crossmember with one bolt and didn't have the extra assembly to engage it with the starting crank. Interesting to see how these things evolved. What's it say on the lubricator? I'd like to recreate that.
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  #32  
Old 12-18-2015, 01:11:04 AM
19-65Port 19-65Port is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

I always wondered if the 4 pipes were original, but the more I looked at it appears correct. The trans shaft is setup for 2 pulleys also. I don't believe it's drilled for the brackets for the starting tank also.
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  #33  
Old 12-18-2015, 06:40:04 AM
G Willikers G Willikers is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

19-65Port,
I am wondering if one or the other of the serial number plates has been changed on those two tractors. They are so similar, yet far apart in numbers. You'd almost wonder if they did not come out of Hamilton at the same time for road work?
The one you are driving sat in a gravel pit near Stratford for years. The old fellow who had it was named Otto Rounds. Some guys used to call him Outa Round! He is long, long gone so where he may have got that tractor is probably lost. The rad, or maybe all the tubes were stolen when it sat there. I was at the sale when it sold back in the mid 80s. Can't recall what was there for a rad, maybe just the frame work. I bought a rad for an 11-22 Sawyer-Massey there that I eventually traded for some Eagle tractor parts. That rad is on a 20-40 that is now in Minnesota, I think?

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  #34  
Old 12-18-2015, 03:24:06 PM
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

G is it the one at hastings with your rad?

---------- Post added at 01:24 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:21 PM ----------

Post #26 http://www.smokstak.com/forum/showth...t=18576&page=2

I guess you can't upload the sane pic twice.
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Old 12-18-2015, 07:08:23 PM
G Willikers G Willikers is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

Tim,
Yes, I believe so. Thanks.

Davey,
Here is what I see on the lubricator:

Warning
Carefully Strain Oil
And Be Sure All Oil
Feeds Are Delivering
Sufficient Oil To (Motor)

I bracketed (Motor) as that is basically wiped out but seems to be Motor. I am 93.76% sure anyway.
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Old 12-18-2015, 08:28:12 PM
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

G;
The best glass for those Detroits is the thin glass used on portraits. The glass is mounted in a thin brass stamped frame.
il n'y a pas de quoi
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Old 12-19-2015, 01:43:46 PM
G Willikers G Willikers is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

A few more pictures to keep this thread going. I think ESG is busy doing her Christmas chopping - don't forget that new pickup I asked about! Make or colour are not critical.
A picture of the clutch and then drive wheels, etc.. I always get a kick out of the Sawyer-Massey casting numbers - G526 & 1/2. You see that on the steam engines as well. Not sure what the G526 fits?
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Old 12-20-2015, 01:30:24 PM
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

A few more random pictures.
The owner had a new top tank made locally for the radiator and then had it coated. There are a lot of bolts holding that tank on and with the new gasket, there were only a couple of minor seeps. We never touched the bottom tank or gasket and it is holding well - it is cast. There were several years worth of mouse nests in there, and maybe other critters. They really had things jammed up.
Last winter, we did a lot of work on the motor, in frame. Pulled the rods and poured one new rod bearing. There were a couple of broken rings. The heads were gone through and the old elbows for the exhausts removed. That took some careful and time consuming work getting them out without messing up the threads in the heads. The jugs and heads were filled with detritus, mouse related plus a lot of muck build up. Luckily, there was no damage from the muck and dampness.
She needs some TLC on the steering and front axle and some other minor stuff but should be good to go. The tractor must have had a lot of hours but evidently very little heavy draw bar work.
There were a few of the bigger Sawyer-Massey gas/oil tractors (50hp) here in Ontario back in the day. An old friend (long departed) north of London said they had one and had a threshing circle. He said it was maybe too big for the area. One time, they shoved the threshing mill up on a barn floor and right out through the other side. That might be related to the brake issue mentioned above!
There is some prairie-like land down between Chatham and Windsor. There were some bigger threshing outfits down there. I know there was an unusal 22-45 Eagle down there with 20 inch rear wheels running a big Waterloo mill. There is also a very large Advance-Rumely mill around there that I often wondered what must have run it? There is also a larger Sawyer-Massey mill down in there with matching fuel tender that I have heard was run with one of the bigger tractors. It would be nice to get pictures of those outfits!
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  #39  
Old 12-20-2015, 01:47:17 PM
halcon halcon is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

Hi Rick: was it a case of the gasoline burners were set up with the 4 straight pipes for exaust, and the kerosene burners had a manifold and plumbed in to heat the intake manifold??
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Old 12-20-2015, 02:03:56 PM
G Willikers G Willikers is offline
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Default Re: Tractors in December!

Mr. Halcon,
That does seem to be the case; though there don't seem to be many of the 4-stackers. There are some variations in the Prairie tractors as well.
Where this 20-40 came from, the departed gentleman also had an 11-22 and a big Sawyer-Massey that he bought in Manitoba years ago. He restored and showed the big tractor for years and always referred to it a 30-60! ( It is now in CT) Many argued the point with him; but he swore that he had talked with an old chap who had worked at the Hamilton works who said they did turn out a few tractors rated 30-60, "all-gas" outfits!??! I have never seen this confirmed in the literature or advertisements; but never argued the point with him.
At Winnipeg in 1913, the Sawyer-Massey tractor, rated 25-45 put out 45 hp average on the 2 hour brake run and 58.3 on the half our max run. Average dbhp in ploughing was 24.50. After that, they changed the ratings up to 25-50 or sometimes 27-50. But I guess 60 hp was a possibility under the right conditions.
This all requires more research and thought!
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