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Welding Shop

Miller AEAD-200LE


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  #1  
Old 01-19-2018, 07:33:41 PM
Beisert Beisert is offline
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Unhappy Miller AEAD-200LE

Hey guys got a small problem with my miller it has an onan ccka-ms/3848j engine on it and my problem is I replaced the starter and tried to start it the starter spins like crazy but doesn't engage the flywheel and I have a blue wire coming from the start switch to the starter that gets very hot! also replaced both battery cables and battery. It engaged probably 3 times and that's it cant get it to do it again. yes everything is tight and clean I'm stumped
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Old 01-19-2018, 08:55:35 PM
slip knot slip knot is offline
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Default Re: miller aead-200le

I've got this same machine but haven't had that problem yet. the starter switch wire shouldn't be getting hot, its not carrying any load other than the solenoid. if all the wiring is correct I would think your starter may be messed up.

Have you tried to jumper the starter from the positive to the solenoid wire. it may have burned up the starter switch on the dash panel. mine is just a simple self centering toggle and not made for much load.
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Old 01-20-2018, 12:02:34 AM
cobbadog cobbadog is offline
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Default Re: miller aead-200le

Have you closely compared both old and new starters? Size of pinion gear and the throw?
I agree no wires should be hot but they may get warm when being used. If hot there is an issue somewhere.
Try a jump start with another battery directly to the starter and see what happens. If it works that way you do have a wiring or switch problem.
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Old 01-20-2018, 11:58:25 AM
Beisert Beisert is offline
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Default Re: miller aead-200le

you think you could shoot me a picture of how your starter is hooked up?

---------- Post added at 09:58:25 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:57:03 AM ----------

I can jump the solenoid and it will engage the starter idk
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Old 01-20-2018, 12:20:54 PM
slip knot slip knot is offline
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Default Re: Miller AEAD-200LE

its not the best picture (no light in the barn)

I may need to clean those connections up some huh!
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Old 01-20-2018, 02:32:08 PM
Andrew Mackey Andrew Mackey is offline
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Default Re: Miller AEAD-200LE

Sounds like your starter is NFG. It happens! If rebuilt, only as good as the guy working on it. If new, sometimes the factory screws up. Take it back as defective, and get another one. One quick note - is the engine grounded to the battery negative?
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Old 01-20-2018, 04:49:27 PM
Beisert Beisert is offline
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Default Re: Miller AEAD-200LE

so theres nothing attatched to the right terminal on the solenoid? and I only have two yellow wires coming from my voltage regulator

---------- Post added at 02:49:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:48:11 PM ----------

yes my battery is grounded with a new lead to frame that the engine and welder sit on.
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Old 01-20-2018, 04:51:04 PM
I like oldstuff I like oldstuff is offline
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Default Re: Miller AEAD-200LE

The big post on the right gets the braid that powers the motor.
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Old 01-20-2018, 11:04:25 PM
slip knot slip knot is offline
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Default Re: Miller AEAD-200LE

Old stuff nailed it. the braided line to the starter lands on the inner stud.
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Old 01-21-2018, 01:44:23 PM
dkamp dkamp is offline
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Default Re: Miller AEAD-200LE

Heh heh... the way you HAD it wired... when you applied power, your keyswitch was putting power to the motor... rather than closing the solenoid

You're kinda lucky the solenoid wasn't pulling in, as that blue wire would'a got a lot more than just hot...

Solenoid on many starters performs two functions- first is to connect battery to starter motor... second, is to engage the starter gear...

And it's 'staged'... the starter gear linkage acts FIRST, pulling or pushing the gear into engagement with the flywheel, and second (once the solenoid piston is just about fully seated) is to apply the shorting bar across the solenoid's power terminals.

Smallest terminal on the solenoid is the solenoid coil... it pulls the coil in.

There's always TWO big connections on the solenoid- one to the motor, and one to the battery.

Aside note for anyone who ever wondered:
Some starter solenoids have an IGNITION terminal. This terminal gets connected directly to the ignition coil. When the solenoid's shorting bar closes, it also connects battery to this little terminal, so that the coil is powered directly from the battery on a fairly-short path. On many vehicles, there is either a ballast resistor or a resistance wire between ignition key and ignition coil- this solenoid terminal BYPASSES the resistance. This concept was put in place because when cranking, the starter motor pulls a substantial amount of current... enough so that an igntion coil would have normally only gotten say... 9v on a 12v battery system. This led to a rather weak ignition during cranking, so what they did to compensate, was make the ignition coil suitable for good fire at 9V... then they put a current-limiting resistor in series with the ignition coil while running. During cranking, however, you got a direct feed from starter solenoid, and bingo- a nice hot spark! Added side-effect... if you shut the engine down and left the key on, the resistance would minimize the likelyhood of burning up the ignition points... but it still happened. Also still happened to burn up ballast resistors and resistance wires (causing fires...)

Next point of starter-solenoidal history- SOME starter solenoids actually have TWO sets of windings... a PULL IN, and HOLD winding. They're wrapped in the same cavity, just two wires. One of those windings is directly connected to a terminal that contacts the shorting bar... when the solenoid pulls in, the HOLD winding gets fed current (to help hold it in!). The other PULL IN winding is controlled from the starter SWITCH. Reason for this is strikingly similar to above...

When the PULL IN winding is energized, there's full battery voltage on-tap... but as soon as the shorting bar engages the starting motor, system voltage (through the harness, to starter switch contact, and back to the PULL IN winding) drops a fair amount, causing the PULL IN winding to lose strength... and then, it kicks out, causing the starter to momentarily disengage, then spin freely... or worse, re-engage... and chew the gear teeth off a bit.

So if you have any silly antics going on that you just can't figure out... re-read this, and look closely at what 'ya got- the answer may just appear before your eyes.
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  #11  
Old 01-22-2018, 11:49:36 AM
Beisert Beisert is offline
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Default Re: Miller AEAD-200LE

Got it had the wrong wire on the braided post thanks for all your help guys!!!!!!!
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