Antique Tractors
[Home] - [HELP] - [Forums] - [Library] - [Photo Gallery] - [Groups] - [Classified Ads] - [Subscribe] - [Links] - [Books] - [Sponsors] -

Go Back   SmokStak > SmokStak® Old Iron and Tractor Community > Antique Steel Wheel Tractors - Old Iron Lugs and Cleats
Forgot Password? Join Us!

Notices

Antique Steel Wheel Tractors - Old Iron Lugs and Cleats Photos and information about antique steel wheeled farm tractors. This is where to find the heaviest of Old Iron tractors.

Antique Steel Wheel Tractors - Old Iron Lugs and Cleats

Fordson Wehr Governor Oil Level + Trans Oil Questions


this thread has 31 replies and has been viewed 2915 times

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old 04-27-2017, 09:49:03 PM
Ed Bezanson Ed Bezanson is offline
In Memory Of
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Waterford, Connecticut
Posts: 1,414
Thanks: 5,625
Thanked 4,873 Times in 947 Posts
Default Re: Fordson Wehr Governor Oil Level + Trans Oil Questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Welker View Post
Ed,
In post #10 you say about having one run on the original coils. When it comes to hooking up the timer, I wanted to give you a tip on the proper parts.

There are 2 styles of timer rod brackets, one is the style Nik shows that locates the rod straight off the top of the head. These brackets are used with 1925 and newer dashes that have the kill switch at the bottom of the timer quadrant.

Attached is a picture of the older style bracket that drops down along the side of the head, that was used with older dashes from 1924 and earlier that do not have the kill switch.

Most importantly, these 2 different style brackets require 2 different links down to the timer. using the wrong link will either advance or retard the timing too far depending on the combo used.

-The early drop brackets require a shorter rod, roughly 12" end to end.
-The later horizontal brackets require a longer rod roughly 14" end to end.

Incorrectly using the short rod with the horizontal brackets would advance the timing to the point that there is a very good chance the engine will kick and maybe break an arm or wrist!

-Steve
Steve it looks like I'm in for a wild ride when I get to the timer ignition engine [probably later in the summer] and I will be on the phone at every step. Thanks again for all the help and knowledge you have so generously given to all the Fordson nuts out there in tractor heaven Ed B
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Ed Bezanson For This Post:
Sponsored Links
  #22  
Old 04-28-2017, 12:48:08 PM
Nik M Nik M is offline
Registered-I
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Herndon, KS
Posts: 73
Thanks: 45
Thanked 55 Times in 22 Posts
Default Re: Fordson Wehr Governor Oil Level + Trans Oil Questions

Steve, maybe you can shed some light on this. Why do some Holley 295s have the needle at the front of the float chamber and others have the needle at the rear? I've seen many photos of Fordsons with one or the other. Was there a year change?
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 05-02-2017, 10:30:58 AM
Steve Welker Steve Welker is offline
Registered-I
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Gratz, Pennsylvania
Posts: 271
Thanks: 397
Thanked 764 Times in 214 Posts
Default Re: Fordson Wehr Governor Oil Level + Trans Oil Questions

Nik,
Wow, most people never took notice that there are 2 different styles of 295 float chambers. I've only ever seen a handful of the ones with the needle in the front. All have been on 1925 tractors, so I assume this is the earlier style. Also, I have a 4 page booklet put out by Holley introducing the 295 in 1925, and this shows the needle in the front, which confirms this as the first style. I do believe this was done this way for only a short period of time , as you do not see all that many like this.

What is even more intriguing is the 2 bolt governor flange on the front of the vaporizer. The ones with the needle in front have a different style governor flange that is much smaller and the 2 holes are not horizontal. I've seen a few vaporizers like this, but never personally seen a governor that fits this style flange!?! The first picture attached shows a rod attached, but not the full governor attachment. Why was this change to this style flange for the early 295s then changed back to the standard style used on most 295s, all 280s, and all Kingston Regenerators.

Attached also is a good picture of a early style 295 with the different governor flange, and the needle in the front of the fuel bowl. And I attached a picture of one page from the 295 brochure that clearly shows the needle in the front, and you can also tell it has the different governor flange.

To answer your question, I don't know why the difference. Needle in front 1925, needle in back later 1925 thru end of production.

-Steve
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	early 295 -2.jpg
Views:	82
Size:	57.1 KB
ID:	281287   Click image for larger version

Name:	295 VAPORIZER GOVENOR FLANGE.jpg
Views:	75
Size:	146.4 KB
ID:	281288   Click image for larger version

Name:	295 paper.jpg
Views:	75
Size:	112.0 KB
ID:	281289  
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Steve Welker For This Post:
  #24  
Old 05-02-2017, 08:52:08 PM
Nik M Nik M is offline
Registered-I
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Herndon, KS
Posts: 73
Thanks: 45
Thanked 55 Times in 22 Posts
Default Re: Fordson Wehr Governor Oil Level + Trans Oil Questions

Great info, Steve. Mine's mid-25 by serial number assuming steady production and has the needle at the rear.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 03-21-2018, 12:41:16 AM
Nik M Nik M is offline
Registered-I
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Herndon, KS
Posts: 73
Thanks: 45
Thanked 55 Times in 22 Posts
Default Re: Fordson Wehr Governor Oil Level + Trans Oil Questions

Steve, I found this in a 1925 Ford Service Bulletin. It aligns with your 85W to 90W comment. As you mentioned, they changed their minds later, but in 1925 they evidently thought the bearings weren't lubed enough with heavy oil.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	1925 Service Bulletin.jpg
Views:	48
Size:	63.7 KB
ID:	306103  
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Nik M For This Post:
  #26  
Old 03-21-2018, 07:26:35 AM
Steve Welker Steve Welker is offline
Registered-I
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Gratz, Pennsylvania
Posts: 271
Thanks: 397
Thanked 764 Times in 214 Posts
Default Re: Fordson Wehr Governor Oil Level + Trans Oil Questions

Nik,
I never seen that statement before, and I have copies of most of the service buliuens. Must have missed that.

It does make sense. what they are saying, but engine oil does seem really thin for the worm gear to be properly lubed under a constant load like plowing.
-Steve
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Steve Welker For This Post:
  #27  
Old 03-21-2018, 04:28:27 PM
Nik M Nik M is offline
Registered-I
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Herndon, KS
Posts: 73
Thanks: 45
Thanked 55 Times in 22 Posts
Default Re: Fordson Wehr Governor Oil Level + Trans Oil Questions

Steve, Et al.,

This link provides a plethora of Model T and associated information. They are searchable PDFs, and the above information was in the 1925 service bulletins. The service bulletins are helpful in roughly dating changes to the Fordson (as you know).

http://www.cimorelli.com/mtdl/default.htm
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Nik M For This Post:
  #28  
Old 03-22-2018, 08:53:51 AM
Steve Welker Steve Welker is offline
Registered-I
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Gratz, Pennsylvania
Posts: 271
Thanks: 397
Thanked 764 Times in 214 Posts
Default Re: Fordson Wehr Governor Oil Level + Trans Oil Questions

Nik,
I have been on that site, and have all the bulletins downloaded for future easy reference. You are 100% correct that there is a lot of Fordson knowledge to be gained from these bulletins. Just the production data with what serial number range was produced what month, and where is great info. Examining the s/n data closely shows how blocks of #ís were assigned to branch plants, and they may not have been used until months after a higher number was used at the main plant. Quite confusing in the early production days, and got much simpler when they were just all produced at the Rouge Plant.
-Steve
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 06-17-2018, 09:33:10 PM
Nik M Nik M is offline
Registered-I
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Herndon, KS
Posts: 73
Thanks: 45
Thanked 55 Times in 22 Posts
Default Re: Fordson Wehr Governor Oil Level + Trans Oil Questions

Steve, et al.,

When turning the throttle rod over 180 degrees to engage the wide slot with the tang rather than the narrow slot, is it necessary to remove the rivet shown at 8 o'clock in my first photo? Upon assembling with the wide slot over the tang, the throttle was all but locked up. I took it apart again to find that the rivet head interferes with the throttle rod's slotted disk (see rub marks in second image). I suspect when using the narrow slot over the tang, the wide slot clears this rivet, but when switched around the narrow slot either locks the throttle up or the disk rubs substantially. Perhaps the governor instructions say to remove this rivet, or I'm doing something wrong.

I've also included a couple photos of how I set up the spring tension. It's not adjustable from the seat like the original Wehr setup, but it is adjustable by moving the hook in the brass chain. I played around with the spring tension a little; at first it was too high, and the tractor was surging a little at idle. That was using the narrow slot on the tang. I'm sure there will be further adjustment if I switch it over to the wide slot properly.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_2552.jpg
Views:	53
Size:	101.3 KB
ID:	312656   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_2550.jpg
Views:	50
Size:	103.9 KB
ID:	312657   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_2556.jpg
Views:	46
Size:	127.4 KB
ID:	312658   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_2558.jpg
Views:	39
Size:	107.4 KB
ID:	312659  

Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 07-29-2018, 11:04:23 AM
Steve Welker Steve Welker is offline
Registered-I
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Gratz, Pennsylvania
Posts: 271
Thanks: 397
Thanked 764 Times in 214 Posts
Default Re: Fordson Wehr Governor Oil Level + Trans Oil Questions

Nik,
Sorry I did not see this question when you originally posted. Better late than never.

I do not see the fiber friction disc (part number S503) that is normally between the cup and the end of the throttle rod. This friction disc helps hold the throttle in position, but also acts as a spacer to limit the amount the small notch catches the rivet head.

However, the purpose of the rivet IS to catch the small notch a little when a governor is hooked up. The rivet purpose was to hold the throttle in a position that allowed the governor full range of motion, but was still easy to manually push the throttle closed past the rivet to idle the tractor down. An excellent description of this can be found in the service bulletins with the announcement of the new Holley 280 improvements. I'll look it up and let you know which month/year.

Again, I never liked the feel of the throttle hooked up like this. just seems odd.
-Steve
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Steve Welker For This Post:
Reply

Bookmarks


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

F o r u m Jump

Similar Threads Chosen at Random
Thread Thread Starter F o r u m Replies Last Post
Fordson Fuel, Governor Exhaust Question DTurner Antique Steel Wheel Tractors - Old Iron Lugs and Cleats 17 04-30-2016 09:12:11 PM
Fordson Accessory Wehr Brake Butch Howe Antique Steel Wheel Tractors - Old Iron Lugs and Cleats 19 01-23-2016 07:11:57 PM
1927 Fordson F questions SMertz Antique Steel Wheel Tractors - Old Iron Lugs and Cleats 19 05-19-2013 11:41:37 PM
Fordson F Bosch Mag / Governor Conversion questions sparkie Antique Farm Tractors 16 05-13-2013 11:20:53 PM


Use "Ctrl" mouse wheel to change screen size.
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:27:22 PM.

Smokstak and Enginads site search!


All use is subject to our TERMS OF SERVICE
SMOKSTAK® is a Registered Trade Mark - A Community of Antique Engine Enthusiasts
Copyright © 2000 - 2016 by Harry Matthews P.O. Box 5612 - Sarasota, FL 34277