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Antenna Question


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  #1  
Old 05-25-2019, 03:38:56 PM
cornbinder89 cornbinder89 is offline
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Default Antenna Question

I find myself in the need of an outdoor antenna for NOAA Weather broadcasts. (162mhz) and this came up in a Google search:
https://www.jpole-antenna.com/shop/p.../weather-band/

I have forgot what little I once knew, so am asking for those who do, their thoughts on it.
I plan to mount on the 2nd story eaves of the house or about 24 ft in the air.
My local NOAA station has either changed antennas or broadcast power and I cannot receive them any more. Tried 3 different radios both inside and outside the house. It used to come in, although not super strong at least well enough to hear and get alerts. Now nothing.
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Old 05-25-2019, 03:55:42 PM
Bob Willman Bob Willman is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

I don't know how long ago you could hear your NOAA station but several years ago many of them shifted frequency and some disappeared. The station is Cass county is out of service.

Bob
WB8NQW
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Old 05-25-2019, 04:05:48 PM
Vanman Vanman is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

For what it's worth I ran a two meter J pole about 20 feet off the ground for several years, hooked up only to a 7 watt handheld, and it seemed to work GREAT.

House was on a hill too...

Keith
KE6LRZ
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Old 05-25-2019, 04:22:23 PM
Birken Vogt Birken Vogt is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

Around here the NOAA station is so strong you can hear it if you remove the antenna from the radio completely.
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Old 05-25-2019, 04:26:46 PM
cornbinder89 cornbinder89 is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Willman View Post
I don't know how long ago you could hear your NOAA station but several years ago many of them shifted frequency and some disappeared. The station is Cass county is out of service.

Bob
WB8NQW
Cass County Iowa? If so that is the problem!
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  #6  
Old 05-25-2019, 04:27:10 PM
radiodoc radiodoc is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

If the weather site is at a pretty far distance, it might be better to try using a yagi antenna. Vertically polarized.
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  #7  
Old 05-25-2019, 04:30:51 PM
cornbinder89 cornbinder89 is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

Well that explains it, wonder when it will be back up? it has been off for some time and I thought it was all my end!
No matter how good an antenna I have it will not fix a broken transmitter! Thanks all who responded, I still may fit an antenna when they get the site back up, as our reception was never great, but no use tearing my hair out over a problem I can't fix!
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Old 05-25-2019, 05:39:22 PM
Power Power is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

Here is a current list of NOAA stations and their frequencies in Iowa. One of these should be close enough.


NWR County Coverage Listing for Iowa

DEGRADED - Indicates transmitter is experiencing a temporary degradation of service.
OUT OF SERVICE - Indicates transmitter is temporarily out of service.
State Selection for County Coverage

County Coverage as of May 25 2019 21:33:11. (UTC) Print

County SAME # NWR Transmitter Call Sign Frequency Remarks
Adair 019001 Des Moines WXL57 162.550
Adair 019001 Lenox KXI65 162.450
Adams 019003 Hancock/Pottawattam OUT OF SERVICE KZZ52 162.525
Adams 019003 Lenox KXI65 162.450
Allamakee 019005 Decorah KXI60 162.525
Allamakee 019005 LaCrescent WXJ86 162.550
Allamakee 019005 Prairie Du Chien WWG86 162.500
Appanoose 019007 Lake Rathbun WXN91 162.425
Appanoose 019007 Lancaster WXM36 162.550 ALL
Audubon 019009 Carroll KZZ51 162.425
Audubon 019009 Hancock/Pottawattam OUT OF SERVICE KZZ52 162.525
Benton 019011 Cedar Rapids WXL61 162.475
Black Hawk 019013 Waterloo WXL94 162.550
Boone 019015 Des Moines WXL57 162.550
Boone 019015 Fort Dodge WXK84 162.400 ALL
Bremer 019017 Waterloo WXL94 162.550
Buchanan 019019 Delaware KJY64 162.450
Buchanan 019019 Waterloo WXL94 162.550
Buena Vista 019021 Storm Lake KWN47 162.450
Butler 019023 Iowa Falls WNG666 162.525
Butler 019023 Waterloo WXL94 162.550
Calhoun 019025 Carroll KZZ51 162.425
Calhoun 019025 Fort Dodge WXK84 162.400
Carroll 019027 Carroll KZZ51 162.425
Carroll 019027 Denison WNG668 162.550
Cass 019029 Hancock/Pottawattam OUT OF SERVICE KZZ52 162.525
Cedar 019031 Cedar Rapids WXL61 162.475
Cedar 019031 Maquoketa KZZ83 162.425
Cedar 019031 Quad Cities WXJ73 162.550
Cerro Gordo 019033 Forest City KJY63 162.500
Cerro Gordo 019033 St. Ansgar KXI68 162.450
Cherokee 019035 Sioux City WXL62 162.475
Cherokee 019035 Storm Lake KWN47 162.450
Chickasaw 019037 Decorah KXI60 162.525
Chickasaw 019037 St. Ansgar KXI68 162.450
Chickasaw 019037 Waterloo WXL94 162.550
Clarke 019039 Des Moines WXL57 162.550 North
Clarke 019039 Van Wert KZZ68 162.475
Clay 019041 Milford KZZ80 162.550
Clayton 019043 Delaware KJY64 162.450
Clayton 019043 Dubuque WXL64 162.400
Clayton 019043 Prairie Du Chien WWG86 162.500
Clinton 019045 Maquoketa KZZ83 162.425
Clinton 019045 Quad Cities WXJ73 162.550
Crawford 019047 Carroll KZZ51 162.425
Crawford 019047 Denison WNG668 162.550
Dallas 019049 Des Moines WXL57 162.550
Davis 019051 Fairfield WXN85 162.400 NE
Davis 019051 Lake Rathbun WXN91 162.425
Davis 019051 Lancaster WXM36 162.550 ALL
Decatur 019053 Van Wert KZZ68 162.475
Delaware 019055 Cedar Rapids WXL61 162.475
Delaware 019055 Delaware KJY64 162.450
Delaware 019055 Dubuque WXL64 162.400
Delaware 019055 Maquoketa KZZ83 162.425
Des Moines 019057 Burlington WXN83 162.525
Dickinson 019059 Milford KZZ80 162.550
Dubuque 019061 Delaware KJY64 162.450
Dubuque 019061 Dubuque WXL64 162.400
Dubuque 019061 Maquoketa KZZ83 162.425
Emmet 019063 Milford KZZ80 162.550 WEST
Emmet 019063 Ringsted WNG688 162.475
Fayette 019065 Decorah KXI60 162.525
Fayette 019065 Delaware KJY64 162.450
Fayette 019065 Prairie Du Chien WWG86 162.500
Fayette 019065 Waterloo WXL94 162.550
Floyd 019067 St. Ansgar KXI68 162.450
Floyd 019067 Waterloo WXL94 162.550
Franklin 019069 Forest City KJY63 162.500
Franklin 019069 Iowa Falls WNG666 162.525
Fremont 019071 Essex KZZ50 162.550
Greene 019073 Carroll KZZ51 162.425
Greene 019073 Des Moines WXL57 162.550
Grundy 019075 Iowa Falls WNG666 162.525
Grundy 019075 Marshalltown KXI98 162.500
Grundy 019075 Waterloo WXL94 162.550
Guthrie 019077 Carroll KZZ51 162.425
Guthrie 019077 Des Moines WXL57 162.550
Hamilton 019079 Fort Dodge WXK84 162.400
Hamilton 019079 Iowa Falls WNG666 162.525
Hancock 019081 Forest City KJY63 162.500
Hancock 019081 Ringsted WNG688 162.475
Hardin 019083 Iowa Falls WNG666 162.525
Hardin 019083 Marshalltown KXI98 162.500
Harrison 019085 Hancock/Pottawattam OUT OF SERVICE KZZ52 162.525
Harrison 019085 Omaha KIH61 162.400
Henry 019087 Burlington WXN83 162.525 East
Henry 019087 Fairfield WXN85 162.400
Howard 019089 Decorah KXI60 162.525
Howard 019089 St. Ansgar KXI68 162.450
Humboldt 019091 Fort Dodge WXK84 162.400
Humboldt 019091 Ringsted WNG688 162.475
Ida 019093 Carroll KZZ51 162.425
Ida 019093 Denison WNG668 162.550
Ida 019093 Sioux City WXL62 162.475
Ida 019093 Storm Lake KWN47 162.450
Iowa 019095 Cedar Rapids WXL61 162.475
Iowa 019095 Montezuma KXI62 162.450 West
Jackson 019097 Dubuque WXL64 162.400
Jackson 019097 Maquoketa KZZ83 162.425
Jasper 019099 Des Moines WXL57 162.550
Jasper 019099 Marshalltown KXI98 162.500
Jasper 019099 Montezuma KXI62 162.450
Jefferson 019101 Fairfield WXN85 162.400
Johnson 019103 Cedar Rapids WXL61 162.475
Jones 019105 Cedar Rapids WXL61 162.475
Jones 019105 Delaware KJY64 162.450
Jones 019105 Dubuque WXL64 162.400
Jones 019105 Maquoketa KZZ83 162.425
Keokuk 019107 Cedar Rapids WXL61 162.475
Keokuk 019107 Fairfield WXN85 162.400 SE
Keokuk 019107 Lake Rathbun WXN91 162.425
Keokuk 019107 Montezuma KXI62 162.450 Northwest
Keokuk 019107 Ottumwa WNG730 162.500
Kossuth 019109 Forest City KJY63 162.500
Kossuth 019109 Ringsted WNG688 162.475
Lee 019111 Burlington WXN83 162.525
Lee 019111 Fairfield WXN85 162.400 NW
Lee 019111 Medill WXL99 162.450
Linn 019113 Cedar Rapids WXL61 162.475
Linn 019113 Delaware KJY64 162.450
Louisa 019115 Burlington WXN83 162.525 NE
Louisa 019115 Quad Cities WXJ73 162.550
Lucas 019117 Lake Rathbun WXN91 162.425
Lucas 019117 Van Wert KZZ68 162.475
Lyon 019119 Sioux Falls WXM28 162.400
Madison 019121 Des Moines WXL57 162.550
Mahaska 019123 Lake Rathbun WXN91 162.425
Mahaska 019123 Montezuma KXI62 162.450
Marion 019125 Des Moines WXL57 162.550
Marion 019125 Montezuma KXI62 162.450
Marshall 019127 Marshalltown KXI98 162.500
Mills 019129 Essex KZZ50 162.550
Mills 019129 Hancock/Pottawattam OUT OF SERVICE KZZ52 162.525
Mills 019129 Omaha KIH61 162.400
Mitchell 019131 St. Ansgar KXI68 162.450
Monona 019133 Denison WNG668 162.550
Monona 019133 Sioux City WXL62 162.475
Monroe 019135 Lake Rathbun WXN91 162.425
Montgomery 019137 Essex KZZ50 162.550
Montgomery 019137 Hancock/Pottawattam OUT OF SERVICE KZZ52 162.525
Muscatine 019139 Quad Cities WXJ73 162.550
O'Brien 019141 Sanborn KWN48 162.525
O'Brien 019141 Sioux City WXL62 162.475
Osceola 019143 Sanborn KWN48 162.525
Page 019145 Essex KZZ50 162.550
Page 019145 Maryville KZZ37 162.425 ALL
Palo Alto 019147 Milford KZZ80 162.550 NW & CENTRAL
Palo Alto 019147 Ringsted WNG688 162.475
Plymouth 019149 Sioux City WXL62 162.475
Pocahontas 019151 Fort Dodge WXK84 162.400
Pocahontas 019151 Storm Lake KWN47 162.450
Polk 019153 Des Moines WXL57 162.550
Pottawattamie 019155 Hancock/Pottawattam OUT OF SERVICE KZZ52 162.525
Pottawattamie 019155 Omaha KIH61 162.400
Poweshiek 019157 Marshalltown KXI98 162.500
Poweshiek 019157 Montezuma KXI62 162.450
Ringgold 019159 Lenox KXI65 162.450
Ringgold 019159 Van Wert KZZ68 162.475
Sac 019161 Carroll KZZ51 162.425 Southeast
Sac 019161 Denison WNG668 162.550
Sac 019161 Storm Lake KWN47 162.450
Scott 019163 Quad Cities WXJ73 162.550
Shelby 019165 Carroll KZZ51 162.425 Northeast
Shelby 019165 Denison WNG668 162.550
Shelby 019165 Hancock/Pottawattam OUT OF SERVICE KZZ52 162.525
Sioux 019167 Sanborn KWN48 162.525 Eastern 1/2
Sioux 019167 Sioux City WXL62 162.475
Sioux 019167 Sioux Falls WXM28 162.400
Story 019169 Des Moines WXL57 162.550
Story 019169 Marshalltown KXI98 162.500
Tama 019171 Marshalltown KXI98 162.500
Tama 019171 Montezuma KXI62 162.450 South
Taylor 019173 Lenox KXI65 162.450
Taylor 019173 Maryville KZZ37 162.425
Union 019175 Lenox KXI65 162.450 Western 1/2
Union 019175 Van Wert KZZ68 162.475
Van Buren 019177 Fairfield WXN85 162.400
Van Buren 019177 Medill WXL99 162.450
Wapello 019179 Fairfield WXN85 162.400 E
Wapello 019179 Lake Rathbun WXN91 162.425
Wapello 019179 Ottumwa WNG730 162.500
Warren 019181 Des Moines WXL57 162.550
Washington 019183 Cedar Rapids WXL61 162.475
Washington 019183 Fairfield WXN85 162.400 SW
Wayne 019185 Lake Rathbun WXN91 162.425
Wayne 019185 Van Wert KZZ68 162.475
Webster 019187 Fort Dodge WXK84 162.400
Winnebago 019189 Forest City KJY63 162.500
Winnebago 019189 Ringsted WNG688 162.475
Winneshiek 019191 Decorah KXI60 162.525
Woodbury 019193 Sioux City WXL62 162.475
Worth 019195 Forest City KJY63 162.500
Worth 019195 St. Ansgar KXI68 162.450
Wright 019197 Forest City KJY63 162.500
Wright 019197 Fort Dodge WXK84 162.400
Wright 019197 Iowa Falls WNG666 162.525
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  #9  
Old 05-25-2019, 06:06:27 PM
cornbinder89 cornbinder89 is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

Yeah, I got on NOAA's web site and found more info on the transmitter outage.
It looks like the two closest to me are Essex, IA ( 300 watt) and Omaha, NE (1000 watt). Both are around 55 miles as the crow flies, and I think Omaha would be my best bet if I had an antenna on the roof. Neither are available with the gear I have now, and there is no guarantee that I could get them with an antenna.
For now I wait and see if/when they fix the Hancock transmitter.
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Old 05-25-2019, 06:21:14 PM
Power Power is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by cornbinder89 View Post
Yeah, I got on NOAA's web site and found more info on the transmitter outage.
It looks like the two closest to me are Essex, IA ( 300 watt) and Omaha, NE (1000 watt). Both are around 55 miles as the crow flies, and I think Omaha would be my best bet if I had an antenna on the roof. Neither are available with the gear I have now, and there is no guarantee that I could get them with an antenna.
For now I wait and see if/when they fix the Hancock transmitter.
1000 watts @ 55 miles with a directional antenna should be a piece of cake. I have a portable with about a 24 inch collapsible antenna, and it picks up NOAA station about 50 miles away. I am 1/2 way up a hill.
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Old 05-25-2019, 07:31:18 PM
Radiomike Radiomike is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

Any J-Pole antenna is omni-directional. To get my favourite music station CKUA, I built a 100 Mhz single element cubic quad. I mounted this on the side of the house works very well. I used 0.5'' copper tube and 75ohm coax feed. Lots of calculators out there for dimensions. For my workshop I have a folded dipole antenna with 300ohm feeder.

Mike
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Old 05-25-2019, 09:17:37 PM
uglyblue66 uglyblue66 is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

Back when I was in college,I made a antenna specificly for that frequancy as part of a project. I used a active element and 1 director and 1 reflector element.These were divided of course to be 1 on each side of a pipe.Somewhere in 1 of my books is a simple math formula to use to come up with the length of the active elements,refectors and directors. A Yagi has a bunch of both.
It worked well as in I could turn it 45 degrees and totally loose a station and turn it a bit more and pick up another.
It is Fm which is line of sight,unlike Am which can bounce off the atmosphear,the moon,your hat,whatever. So more directional and more height will both be your friends in this situtation.

As a side note,I wrote a program for my RadioShack PC 3 to help with this.Enter the frequancy and it would give all the info.
Still have the program,computer fell out of my pocket and I got angry and kicked it or something and it busted.The replacement,PC 8 ,never was as good a machine as the 3
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Old 05-27-2019, 05:33:18 PM
dkamp dkamp is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

The quick-easy solution is to nab an old marine VHF antenna and mount it on the side of the house. They're close enough (156-158) to work great.

The signal strength these transmitters kick out is healthy, because they expect people to be able to recieve them inside houses'n stuff. If your RX antenna is up high, the only challenge is feedline loss. If you're getting less than 2db of loss, a simple 1/4w whip would be just fine up there...
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Old 05-27-2019, 10:48:08 PM
Pete Deets Pete Deets is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

cornbinder,
It looks as if you've already done the sluething but judging from the coverage predictions on the NOAA site, I believe Essex may be your better choice.

One thing to know is if a watch or warning is issued for Cass County only then neither of the weather service stations would transmit the digital SAME code for your county. That means if your weather radio is set to listen for events in Cass county only there will not be a code transmitted by those stations that would trigger your receiver. Once they get KZZ52 back on the air that transmitter will send out the specific county code that will trigger your radio.

As for an antenna, do you still have an outdoor TV antenna? If it has VHF capability it would work fine to feed your weather radio at least as an experiment.................PD

Last edited by Pete Deets; 05-27-2019 at 10:51:10 PM. Reason: clarity
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Old 05-28-2019, 08:41:42 AM
cornbinder89 cornbinder89 is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

Hooked it to the TV antenna But it is UHF/Digital TV, so not really suited for VHF, and didn't help.
I don't care about the SAME auto warning codes, All I would want would be a tornado warning, but the thing goes off for everything from flood (we are not in a flood area) to Amber alerts and thunderstorms. Not saying those things aren't important, but the alarm goes off so often to make it useless, so I don't program it.
Most of our weather comes from the south-west or west so Omaha would make more sense than Essex, which is south east.
I'm just going to wait on them to get the tower/transmitter back up.
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Old 05-28-2019, 03:23:39 PM
Pete Deets Pete Deets is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

The TV station I work for partners with a hardware store chain to promote the weather radios during April each year. I end up programming several hundred radios each year so am a little familiar with them.

What make & model do you have? It may be able to be programmed to give you an alarm when only a tornado warning is issued. When the weather service gets the station back on the air I'd be happy to lend any pointers I can.........PD
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Old 05-28-2019, 05:12:33 PM
cornbinder89 cornbinder89 is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

Got a pair of Midlands, one is new, the other is likely 10 years old. I have the paper manual somewhere. All is moot until I can receive from the local transmitter.
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Old 05-28-2019, 05:18:33 PM
gnucklehead gnucklehead is offline
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Default Re: Antenna Question

FWIW - any 'ol 1/2 wave VHF mobile whip would be smaller/thinner/lighter than a J-pole and be more then adequate.. I also like a discone for general receiving tasks
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Old 05-28-2019, 09:57:08 PM
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Default Re: Antenna Question

This old 2m VHF Yagi does Ok grabbing the not so local weather stations...even resonates at 162MHz....
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Old 05-28-2019, 09:57:14 PM
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Default Re: Antenna Question

Mighty nice of them to draw up a powerpoint although the outlook doesn't look very good (no pun intended). Recommended alternates Essex or Lenox, but there is some splotchy coverage in W.Cass from Omaha. Hard to tell if you'll need something more directional and/or a line amp to overcome cable loss.
https://www.weather.gov/media/oax/transmitters.pdf

Consider building a dipole or folded dipole with a 300-75 ohm transformer, temporarily connected to your existing tv cable as a test vertical orientation on a standoff from the mast.. If it doesn't work well enough, you'll need a dipole as the driven element on your Yagi
https://centerfireantenna.com/folded...nner-antennas/
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