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Hit & Miss Gas Engine Discussion Meet collectors of hit and miss engines, ask questions about collecting, restoring and showing antique flywheel engines.

Hit & Miss Gas Engine Discussion

2 hp vertical Famous?


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  #1  
Old 01-06-2008, 06:05:12 PM
Johnny T Johnny T is offline
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Default 2 hp vertical Famous?

Well first, what's the proper way to measure to get a gib key size, or does anyone know the size of the gib keys for a 2hp vertical famous. Second, i have the old style gas pump that is all cast and the shaft is stuck inside the outer casing. does anyone know what is inside it and would it be ok to apply heat to try freeing it up, or do i just continue the slow way of soaking it in k1. 3rd, does anyone know of where I could get a muffler that is easier on the budget than what starbolt has for $95. Last how does the eccentric strap for the water pump connect on to the water pump eccentric. I have both pieces and the strap is wider than the eccentric and the hole is the same as the inner part of the eccentric. i'd put a pic in this post but don't know how to do it.
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Old 01-06-2008, 09:13:25 PM
Walt Roys Walt Roys is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vert famous ?'s

Johnny,
I believe gib keys are simply the measurement of the keyway. They are tapered to lock an object on a shaft. They are a lot easier to put in than to take out. Some times you have to drill them and colapse them on themselves to get them out. They are a very good fastner.
As to your waterpump question. One the best ways would be to use electrolesis. Look in the achives for that subject and you will find a ton of info. It will probably loosen it with the least damage. Those pumps are about $350 to have rebuilt so be very careful. I've included some pics of my 2hp vert. water pump eccentric.Hope this helps.
Walt
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  #3  
Old 01-06-2008, 09:32:26 PM
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Default Re: 2 hp vert famous ?'s

The Famous fly wheels have a split hub with a bolt that tightens them to the shaft so the tapered gib keys aren't really needed. Just measure the key hole and find a key that's the same size.
The fuel pump is just a straight shaft inside the housing with a check ball laying in the bottom. If you can get the packing nut off the top the pump shaft should pull straight out. Assuming the pump is cast iron and not brass, as a last resort I would heat the pump up slowly and evenly in a charcoal grill. I wouldn't use a torch.
Save yourself some headaches and pay Starbolt the $95.00 for a muffler. You'll never find an original and there aren't that many aftermarket suppliers. Your playing with a $3500.00 + or - engine. $95.00 to complete it properly isn't bad.
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Old 01-06-2008, 09:33:13 PM
Johnny T Johnny T is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vert famous ?'s

actually it's my fuel pump thats froze, but for that spindle the eccentric strap goes on does that come off the engine then i put the strap in place, and then but the eccentric spindle inside the strap hole? also do I have to have the speed regualtor lever that I managed to catch a glimpse of in photo2 i thought i saw that they were optional equipment, but i wanted to be sure since i don't have one for my engine.
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Old 01-06-2008, 09:38:05 PM
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Default Re: 2 hp vert famous ?'s

The eccentric spindle is part of the cam gear. The eccentric strap just slides over it. Nothing holds it on to the eccentric. The water pump being bolted to the engine, in line with the eccentric, will keep the strap from coming off.
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Old 01-06-2008, 09:39:43 PM
J.B. Castagnos J.B. Castagnos is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vert famous ?'s

Gibb keys are available in differnet widths and lengths. Measure the width of you keyway, and the length you need. The key had to be fitted correctly, I use a permanent marker, slide the key in, file the high spots, repeat, get as much contact as you can. On the water pump, you can try plugging the outlet, fill with oil, and pump grease into the inlet.
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Old 01-06-2008, 09:40:54 PM
Johnny T Johnny T is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vert famous ?'s

my pulley side flywheel is off but my governor side flywheel is still on. I need to get it off since my governor bracket is broken and i was wondering what the easiest recommended way is to remove the flywheel with out damaging the #'s on the end of the crank. (1st time engine resto) when i put it back together is there a recommended size for the split hub bolt
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Old 01-06-2008, 09:51:34 PM
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Default Re: 2 hp vert famous ?'s

A 2 HP Vertical is a pretty ambitious project for a first time restorer. Just take things very slow and get lots of advice because if you break something on this particular engine its going to be very difficult and very expensive to fix. You came to the right place for the advice.
Getting the flywheel off isn't to bad. Remove the bolt, remove the key. Clean all rust and paint off of crankshaft, soak with penetrating oil. Then take a small wedge and GENTLY tap it into the split in the hub. It doesn't take much!!!! You only need to expand the hub a couple thousandths of an inch and it will slide right off the crank. BE CAREFUL NOT TO BUST THE FLYWHEEL!!!!
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Old 01-06-2008, 11:00:03 PM
Rob Charles Rob Charles is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vert famous ?'s

The earlier Famous water pump straps were a split and bolted type . If there's a flange on the ecc on the cam gear at the outside edge you may have the wrong strap for your engine.Gib keys aren't really needed on the vert Famous but they originally came that way.When you put the fw back on you tighten the bolt then drive in the key.Just snug is all you need no need to drive it all the way til the head hits the fw hub. If it goes easy that far cut a small maybe .005 thick shim for under the key.The speed control lever set up came out probably 1912 or so.Alot of engines dont have 1.The cast iron fuel pump doesn't have anything inside just the plunger. The check valves are seperate parts.I have taken stuck ones aparts by heating the body pretty much all of the way around. No need to heat it red.warm it up hold the body in a vise twist the plunger back and forth. Reheat as needed and don't be in a hurry.Rob
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Old 01-07-2008, 07:26:44 AM
Johnny T Johnny T is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vertical Famous?

yah, my strap doesn't have a split with a bolt, but the part # is correct according to the book i bought from hitnmiss ent. Mines a 1908 so I guess i don't need the speed changer. and then there is a piece that sticks up on the cam. and I don't think the strap will fit on to the eccentric part of my cam.
Thanks for the help so far.
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Old 01-07-2008, 10:06:52 AM
Walt Roys Walt Roys is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vertical Famous?

Johnny,
You have already gotten the very best advice any one can give. Go slow, don't get impatient or in a hurry. The next step is to go to the sponsor list and find Rob Charles' site. Give him a call. He is very knowlegable concerning these engines, and has been very helpful to me with my 2hp vert.
Walt
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Old 01-07-2008, 07:53:10 PM
Johnny T Johnny T is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vertical Famous?

Well I realized that i'm already getting help from rob. he's making me recast gov bracket and one recast weight. oh what's the key to getting a picture to post in one of these threads from my own pic collection on my puter. Then I could show what my eccentric looks like.
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Old 01-08-2008, 12:19:05 AM
Walt Roys Walt Roys is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vertical Famous?

When you go to smokstak, click on the test board. You can practice all you want there and then delete or edit. Practice there till you get it right. I was in the same boat you are two weeks ago. If an old duffer like me can so can you.

Here is a step by step to post:
Above the reply to thread there is a paper clip almost in the middle. Click
That will bring up BROWSE Click on Browse to your pictures on your computer click on OPEN
It will take you back to browse, click on UPLOAD
That should do it
Good luck
Walt
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Old 01-08-2008, 01:50:10 PM
Peter Peter is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vertical Famous?

I got a muffler from starbolt and its very darn close to origional. But you could make one from scratch if you have the time and a lathe. Machine the two ends, roll the steel body. Rivets etc...
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Old 01-08-2008, 07:01:38 PM
Johnny T Johnny T is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vertical Famous?

Here's what I have on for my eccentric.
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Old 01-08-2008, 07:56:13 PM
Johnny T Johnny T is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vertical Famous?

I had to resize the photo
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Old 01-08-2008, 08:19:47 PM
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Don Oberholtzer Don Oberholtzer is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vertical Famous?

It looks like you have some of the flang missing, and it will take a split strap that is smaller in width than the later style. Some collecters machine the flang off. I always like to keep as original as possiable.You have the older style engine that most collecters look for.
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Old 01-08-2008, 08:27:17 PM
Johnny T Johnny T is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vertical Famous?

Does anyone have a pic of what the flang that don is talking about. also don do you make a reproduction of the 2 piece strap or do you or anyone else know who does, or does an original IH happen to be around somewhere on the Stak?
Thanks, Johnny
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Old 01-09-2008, 07:38:53 PM
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Don Oberholtzer Don Oberholtzer is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vertical Famous?

I have the split strap casting for machining. The differance is in the width for some reason, we are working on one at this time trying to get the problem resolved.
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Old 01-09-2008, 10:54:58 PM
Johnny T Johnny T is offline
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Default Re: 2 hp vertical Famous?

Well Don, keep me in mind for one of the 2 piece straps once you have one made that will work properly. Oh, i seen that you make reproduction water pumps. How much stuff should be inside the pump on the valve end. On mine all I see is a round sewer grate trap that the lever moves up and down but doesn't seem to be much else or much operation on that front. Do you by chance rebuild old water pumps and ensure that they work properly. I may ask the same thing about my old style (cast) fuel pump if I get it freed up.
Thank you, Johnny
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