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Vintage Diesel and Oil Engines Fairbanks Morse, Lister, Petter, Witte and other pump injected Diesel oil engines.

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Advice Needed Large Worthington & Fairbanks-Morse Diesel Generators


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  #1  
Old 01-27-2017, 11:27:07 AM
2Phargone 2Phargone is offline
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Default Advice Needed Large Worthington & Fairbanks-Morse Diesel Generators

Hoping for suggestions / advice / input from some of the experts here regarding five large, magnificent old Diesel Generators we have to dispose of.

We are getting ready to demolish a large building on a DOD installation here in Florida. Parts of the items involved in the building that we have to dispose of are five large antique diesel generators (2 - Worthingtons & 3 - Fairbanks-Morse).

For now they are slated to go to the local metal recycler by the pound however these engines and generators are complete and I hate the thought of turning such magnificent pieces of history into foreign cars so hereís my questions:

Does anyone know of some facility or institution (museum?) that saves such things for their historical value that might be interested?

Also, unfortunately someone has removed the ID Tags on all five of these engines so would like a recommendation or suggestion of a source that I could go to for specifications for these engines? (Particularly looking for horsepower, weight, etc.)

We can clearly see where the ID Tags used to be before they were removed but is there some other way to identify these motors? (The ID Tags are there for the generators but not the engines.)

Thanks in advance for any help or recommendations!

Here are a few photos of these units:
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Last edited by BTPost; 01-27-2017 at 01:55:54 PM. Reason: Please keep to a single Thread for any ONE Project.... and in only ONE Forum....
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Old 01-27-2017, 05:17:52 PM
YellowLister YellowLister is offline
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Default Re: Advice Needed Large Worthington & Fairbanks-Morse Diesel Generators

Thank you for offering them to someone instead of junking them.. I have a good friend by plant city flordia that may be able to store them.


What is scrap value on them?
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Old 01-27-2017, 06:41:51 PM
G.M.Johnson G.M.Johnson is offline
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Default Re: Advice Needed Large Worthington & Fairbanks-Morse Diesel Generators

The Fairbanks look like opposed piston 38D8's in 6 cylinder configuration.
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Old 01-27-2017, 07:08:29 PM
Ed Bezanson Ed Bezanson is offline
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Default Re: Advice Needed Large Worthington & Fairbanks-Morse Diesel Generators

The Florida Flywheelers have a large collection of big engines on display at their shows near Ft. Meade area. They have a Snow engine that took many flatbed loads to get to the site. It took 4-6 years to mount and assemble. They have a web site and they are a dedicated bunch of guys. Their show is coming up near the end of Feb. Please don't scrap them unless you have no takers. Oh you will have to donate them since most groups have 501C3 tax exempt status and give a tax write off for feds. Ed B
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Old 01-27-2017, 08:50:31 PM
Combustor Combustor is offline
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Default Re: Advice Needed Large Worthington & Fairbanks-Morse Diesel Generators

Hello 2Phargone,
Is it possible that when DOD decommissioned these, that they removed and filed away the plates? A local contractor here acquired a large gen set as part of a demolition job, and the plate was missing. I asked an employee of the power authority about it and he looked and found it filed away in archives. A carton of beer guaranteed its safe return, so worth asking. Regards,
Combustor.
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Old 01-28-2017, 09:10:09 AM
2Phargone 2Phargone is offline
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Default Re: Advice Needed Large Worthington & Fairbanks-Morse Diesel Generators

Quote:
Originally Posted by yellowlister View Post
Thank you for offering them to someone instead of junking them.. I have a good friend by plant city flordia that may be able to store them.


What is scrap value on them?
I am currently in the process of getting quotes from local recyclers however as of this writing I do not have firm pricing. That’s one of the reasons I’m trying to identify these units as best as possible so that we have a good handle on the weight without actually taking them to the scrap yard. In talking to local crane people for lifting and transporting these units I’m being told that scrap prices for these are way down right now.

Unfortunately we will not be able to donate these to a good cause as we are held to “Best Value” contractually for all recyclables on this project however in the event some historical entity or collector is able to pay one-dollar over scrap value we will have to know the weight or at least come close.

We were able to get fairly valuable input from members of the department on this same Base who handles all the service and O & M on the current engines (Caterpillars) and generators which are located in another building. Two of these gentlemen actually helped maintain these very engines so they were very helpful with information such as fluid quantities which we must pump and vacate prior to removal.

They are telling us that these engines alone will likely weigh 40,000 Lbs. and the generators might go as much as an additional 40,000 Lbs making it a total of 40-Tons each. Again, nothing scientific or definitive on the weights but rather a best guess from men who have worked around these units.

Thanks for your comment & input Yellowlister.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokinFlux View Post
The Fairbanks look like opposed piston 38D8's in 6 cylinder configuration.
When I took these photos the majority of the windows in this building was still boarded up and the power was off so with very little light in the room the Fairbanks are in the pics weren't so good.

Thanks for your input. Much appreciated!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed Bezanson View Post
The Florida Flywheelers have a large collection of big engines on display at their shows near Ft. Meade area. They have a Snow engine that took many flatbed loads to get to the site. It took 4-6 years to mount and assemble. They have a web site and they are a dedicated bunch of guys. Their show is coming up near the end of Feb. Please don't scrap them unless you have no takers. Oh you will have to donate them since most groups have 501C3 tax exempt status and give a tax write off for feds. Ed B
Yes, I’ve been to the Flywheeler’s show in Ft. Meade some years back and needless to say it was more than impressive. Coincidentally that’s how I was made aware of this forum. A close friend of mine was at the Flywheeler’s show a week or two ago and happened to send me a photo of a restored Cushman scooter while he was there.

Since I had completely forgotten about the Flywheeler’s for a possible source of information for these engines I called my friend and asked him to inquire with vendors as to a good forum to post these inquiries on and wallah, here we are.

Unfortunately our hands are tied contractually with regard to donating these units (see reply to Yellowlister above).

Thanks for your comment and input Ed.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Combustor View Post
Hello 2Phargone,
Is it possible that when DOD decommissioned these, that they removed and filed away the plates? A local contractor here acquired a large gen set as part of a demolition job, and the plate was missing. I asked an employee of the power authority about it and he looked and found it filed away in archives. A carton of beer guaranteed its safe return, so worth asking. Regards,
Combustor.
That was my assumption also however when we queried the department that handles the O & M & service on the existing backup power generators which includes two gentlemen that actually serviced these units they said no such policy was in-place. Their guess was more of a selfish assumption which they thought it was more likely one of the mechanics that retired after the units were taken out of service, peeled the tags off and took them with him.

Can’t imagine someone doing that for prosperity or ego or whatever the reason but then again every time I think I’ve heard it all I turn on the news and certain elements of this society manages to come up with another shocker.

LOL – Now that I’m seeing your path to success I’m thinking maybe I should’ve dangled a keg in front of the guys that have been so helpful with information eh?

Thanks Combuster for your valued input.
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Old 01-29-2017, 12:16:38 AM
Bill Hazzard Bill Hazzard is offline
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Default Re: Advice Needed Large Worthington & Fairbanks-Morse Diesel Generators

That is what I was thinking, after rigging, hauling and cutting up, one dollar over scrap price will be one dollar total.
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Old 01-29-2017, 06:28:43 AM
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Elden DuRand Elden DuRand is offline
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Default Re: Advice Needed Large Worthington & Fairbanks-Morse Diesel Generators

Quote:
Originally Posted by akuna View Post
Well at scrap prices in my yard, they may charge you to dispose of them for you. Not sure what scrap is in your area, last time I called it was 20 bucks a ton here.

The generators will be worth more, but still mixed scrap and not worth as much as copper.

Have to remember they will have the cost of hauling and cutting up to get any kind of price.
That's what the owners of the F-M gensets found out when they wanted to dispose of them in the powerhouse they wanted to convert to a cafeteria. They were quoted several tens of thousands of dollars by the scrapper to remove them without harming the building.

A friend and I got them a better deal. A monetary donation to the owners and proof that they were going to 501-C3's got them saved. The last I heard, they were all restored and running.

Here's the story in case you haven't seen it:
http://www.eldensengines.com/F-M%20P...20Station.html
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Old 01-29-2017, 11:17:13 AM
2Phargone 2Phargone is offline
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Default Re: Advice Needed Large Worthington & Fairbanks-Morse Diesel Generators

Wow thatís a great success story and my hatís off to you, your friend and the team that made it happen.

This is the kind of idea I was looking for here however unfortunately time is not on my side with trying to go this route. I knew going in that I had a low percentage chance of this having a happy ending such as yours did as this sort of effort takes quite a bit of time especially when your depending on volunteers. For instance your example with three gensets, two 2-Cyl FMís and one 5-Cyl FM appears to have taken just short of a year from concept to extricating them from the building.

Itís not all bad news in our case however because as long as we can show that getting these units to a historical end user is more monetarily beneficial then scrapping them out we wouldnít have to depend on volunteers to prep them and extricate them from the building. Unless of course the recipient(s) of the units would prefer to participate in the removal preparation to be sure they have all the ancillary components necessary for assembly and start-up on their end which would be understandable.

Iím still looking for advice / suggestions on how we can identify these engines with the tags missing? Any ideas there would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks again Elden DuRand for sharing your story of success. It gives me inspiration and hope that such a thing is still possible.
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Old 01-29-2017, 09:01:15 PM
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Elden DuRand Elden DuRand is offline
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Default Re: Advice Needed Large Worthington & Fairbanks-Morse Diesel Generators

At first, we never figured that the gensets would be saved. Once we found that the owners really wanted to save them and three qualified clubs volunteered to to take them and restore them to running condition, the project sort of "growed like Topsy".

I was only the chronicler and wasn't able to travel to the island to get dirty.
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