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Onan 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life


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  #1  
Old 01-14-2017, 09:23:21 PM
JohnnyC JohnnyC is offline
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Default Onan 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life.

I just hauled home from the State of Pennsylvania a 7.5 JB FL made in early April 1991 (see second picture) with only 216 hours on the hour meter along with an LT II transfer switch and ALL documentation (see 3rd picture below).

The JB has some desirable options such as the B150 special 3 phase "YD" extended stack that will deliver full output on both 1 and 3 phase as well as the C1 option which is factory tri-fuel. Other options are low oil pressure and the overspeed cut-off options, and the oil base for an optional heater. An additional accessory that this JB has is a full AC instrument meter panel. (see first picture below for the list of options).

I have no clue were this JB lived its life when it rolled out of the Onan factory, but it must have been installed in a commercial environment of some kind. In the documentation is paper work for engineering approvals and a copy of a certificate from the State of Pennsylvania.

As usual and like my other threads of other genset refurbishments this thread will most likely run 25 to 30 pages and many months as I progress through the JB's recovery to a new life by posting updates, tons of pictures, and asking questions. My goal is to get the JB running and looking like new and make it a functional part of my needs at my property so it will be ready when the lights go out.

For openers to this thread I posted 4 pictures below and were explained above. I have many pictures to post later on the JB's current condition and I'll throw in some pictures of the transfer switch although I have no plans to use it. The switch is in new condition and has some really neat parts inside of it that I may play with as time permits.

JohnnyC
New Jersey
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  #2  
Old 01-14-2017, 09:34:15 PM
Ben Clarke Ben Clarke is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

I believe Pennsylvania had special specs for generators not sure what they where or if yours has them (option C1?) Maybe others can chime in.
great find you are the custodian of a set that will out last you and yours.
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Old 01-14-2017, 09:39:05 PM
JohnnyC JohnnyC is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Clarke View Post
I believe Pennsylvania had special specs for generators not sure what they where or if yours has them (option C1?) Maybe others can chime in.
great find you are the custodian of a set that will out last you and yours.
The C1 option is for a combination carburetor otherwise known as a tri-fuel carburetor ( gasoline, propane, and natural gas). You raise a good question!!! What are the differences between the special Pennsylvania gennys and non-Pennsylvania gennys? This JB was purchased from Keystone Onan Power Inc, Harrisburg, Pa according to my documentation. I am not sure if this certificate means anything regarding the JB or its installation (see picture below).

JohnnyC
New Jersey
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Old 01-14-2017, 09:46:16 PM
len k len k is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

I remember people saying state of Pennsylvania had special fire protection code requirements. No sparking. Relays were enclosed type, covers over brushes. Maybe they were worried about flour and coal dust.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyC View Post
......This JB was purchased from Keystone Onan Power Inc, Harrisburg, Pa according to my documentation.......
Owwwww...........Harrisburg.... Did you bring your Geiger counter?
Three Mile Island.

Last edited by len k; 01-14-2017 at 10:01:19 PM.
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Old 01-14-2017, 09:55:12 PM
Vanman Vanman is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

Wow, that thing sure looks like a beauty. I'd bet the most time you'll spend on this project is building a cart and maybe a meter box. The generator looks like it just needs an oil change a bath lol.
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Old 01-14-2017, 10:06:36 PM
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

Huh. That's the exact same spec number as the 'Toledo' sets that some of us snapped up a few years back. Mine is also 16581D, but is a 1993 model...

Does yours, by chance, have electronic ignition? (All the Toledo sets did, though I don't think they were shipped that way from Onan)

I do not think these are Pennsylvania variants.


Last edited by Jim McIntyre; 01-14-2017 at 10:38:14 PM.
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Old 01-14-2017, 10:50:18 PM
JohnnyC JohnnyC is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim McIntyre View Post
Huh. That's the exact same spec number as the 'Toledo' sets that some of us snapped up a few years back. Mine is also 16581D, but is a 1993 model...

Does yours, by chance, have electronic ignition? (All the Toledo sets did, though I don't think they were shipped that way from Onan)

I do not think these are Pennsylvania variants.

Jim, this set has points. I would like to know more about the Onan OEM electronic ignition. Is there a thread that fully explains it that you can point me to????

Len, I remember reading the Pa sets had sealed relays, but I checked the control box and the relay is the standard open relay. Unrelated but for the heck of it I snapped a picture of the regulator board and it appears to be the "potted" board and unlike the regulator board in my ex-15.0 JC. Any pros and/or cons with the potted regulator board? (see pictures below)

JohnnyC
New Jersey
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Old 01-14-2017, 10:58:03 PM
yellowlister yellowlister is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

Your board is just very hard or impossible to repair compared to the open type... but are supposed to be more robust and handle time moisture and vibration better being there sealed.

Very cool you got all the paper work with it. Can't wait to see it all dolled up
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Old 01-14-2017, 11:01:38 PM
JohnnyC JohnnyC is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanman View Post
Wow, that thing sure looks like a beauty. I'd bet the most time you'll spend on this project is building a cart and maybe a meter box. The generator looks like it just needs an oil change a bath lol.
It needs paint. The interior is excellent as you can see in the pictures from inside the control box that I previously posted.
Attached below is a snap shot showing the inside of the set with the front tin removed. It just needs a little dusting. The second picture shows mostly the exterior with some of the tins removed. I was working on fixing the no-start problem which was very simple to resolve and just require cleaning the points contacts with #400. You will notice the exterior is dirty and shows scratches here and there. I most likely will repaint it, but the ONLY thing that will change my mind is the possibility of losing all the nice silkscreen labeling. Maybe I will only repaint parts of the exterior and blend it into the silkscreen labels as I did in the past when I repainted my low hour 5.0CCK.

Tomorrow I will make a better assessment on the condition of the exterior since my main focus for today was driving a 260 mile round trip to pick up the JB and getting it to run. Today's mission was accomplished.

JohnnyC
New Jersey
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Old 01-14-2017, 11:01:47 PM
David C David C is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

I also have the same spec, except it is 1994 model. It has the same options but the tag only shows it is good for 5kw on single phase, which was discussed about a year ago. As others mentioned, it looks like it only needs a bath and a cart built.

David C.
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Old 01-14-2017, 11:06:11 PM
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

The main 'con' with the potted AVR is it can't be repaired...
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Old 01-14-2017, 11:06:53 PM
yellowlister yellowlister is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

It looks like Cummins was already at it when they started to take over.. only painting the outside sheet metal tins.. all of the older onans have the tins painted inside and out.. maybe you should work your magic on it and repaint it to be better than when it left the factory
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Old 01-14-2017, 11:22:55 PM
JohnnyC JohnnyC is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

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It looks like Cummins was already at it when they started to take over.. only painting the outside sheet metal tins.. all of the older onans have the tins painted inside and out.. maybe you should work your magic on it and repaint it to be better than when it left the factory
I noticed that too, although my ex-15.0JC was not painted inside too and it was (I think) a 1982 or 1983 model. Anyway, what you and I noticed answers one earlier question in my other thread. The question: Was this JB repainted since there was some minor overspray on the meters? The answer is no. I don't know how the meters got some overspray on them, but the overspray is an exact match to the Onan green and in my documentation it lists the meter package as an accessory that was purchased.

JohnnyC
New Jersey
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Old 01-14-2017, 11:30:43 PM
JohnnyC JohnnyC is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

Just a few additional pictures of my adventure traveling to pick up the JB at the beginning of a snow storm. The storm was not anything major, but did make the roadways slippery and there were a few accidents on the highway.

The first picture shows Route 78 in Pa east of Allentown. The snow was accumulating on the surface of the highway. For those out here from the warm south, this amount of snow would have shut down your state. Up here it is considered a very minor inconvenience especially when getting stuck behind a driver from the warm south doing 25 mph on a 65 mph highway.

The second picture shows the snow as it just started after I bolted down the JB to the wooden bed of my trailer. The JB was also strapped and wrapped in plastic too. It did not budge a hair during the entire 130 mile trip back to north Jersey.

JohnnyC
New Jersey
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Old 01-14-2017, 11:38:48 PM
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

Lastly for tonight, here are several more pictures.

Picture #1) This shows one of the spark plugs. I assume it must be original. It is a Champion and notice circled in red - Made In USA. The threads look good compared to the substandard crap made today. I think they make the spark plugs in Mexico now.

Picture #2) This picture shows the compression tester readings on both cylinders. 140 psi and 130 psi. The difference between the 2 cylinders is 7.7% which easily falls within the 10% tolerance. The tester tool is made by Snap-On and I use it frequently. I believe the reading are correct. Why high compression in a factory tri-fuel set?


JohnnyC
New Jersey
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Old 01-14-2017, 11:56:32 PM
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

Last pictures for tonight - I am tired and want to start reading the tons of documentation that came with the purchase.

The pictures below are of the LT II Transfer Switch. I have no experience and no interest in switches, but I thought I'd post a few pictures. There seem to be some really cool things inside the switch such as a charger and a digital clock that does something. I got several manuals and supplement paper work on the switch and I will spend a few minutes to read up on it.

My plans for tomorrow

In the morning I want to:
1) Remove the wiring in the control box that is used for connecting the transfer switch. That will reduce the rats nest of wires already inside the control box. If I ever want to hookup the transfer switch, the wiring looks straight forward to reconnect and I got schematics, wring diagrams, manuals and all kinds of documentation on the switch.
2) secure the a/c voltage wires. they are hanging out of the metal cable uncapped and can easily short out or electrocute someone when the set is running. The set is wired for 120/208 3 phase.
3) Hook up a demand regulator and my propane tanks to run the JB correctly.
4) Put away all the tools and crap in my Jeep Grand Cherokee that I hauled along the journey.

I only have the morning to play since the "boss" wants to go to IKEA to look are cabinets for her kitchen and other crap.

JohnnyC
New Jersey
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Old 01-15-2017, 12:07:53 AM
nothingbutdarts nothingbutdarts is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

Use your borescope down the plug hole and see if it's got flat top or high compression pistons!
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Old 01-15-2017, 12:29:51 AM
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

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Originally Posted by nothingbutdarts View Post
Use your borescope down the plug hole and see if it's got flat top or high compression pistons!
I was thinking about it earlier. It may be hard to see a dome, but are high compression pistons identified by a notch of some sort for JB and JC sets?

-------------------------
I found out where this JB was installed. It was installed in a school in Pa. Look at the attached picture below. It shows a "bill of materials and submittal data". Weird thing is the Onan set specified is a 7.5 JB-4R which is a 3 phase only set, right? If that is true, I wonder how they ended up with an extended stack 1 and 3 phase set. All the other specs listed are what I have except for the "critical muffler". I thought the switch was only a 30 amp switch. Looks to be a 60 amp switch by the specs listed in the sheet below. Interesting..

**** Correction: The statements on the 60 amp switch and the 7.5 JB-R4 appear to be what was installed prior to the JB I just purchased. The document in the attachment below was not dated but following the paper trail of other related documents, it may be a document from 1984.
JohnnyC
New Jersey
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Old 01-15-2017, 01:00:13 AM
yellowlister yellowlister is offline
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

Did you get the muffler too? It's 12 wire right?
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Old 01-15-2017, 01:03:20 AM
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Default Re: My 7.5 JB's Recovery Towards A New Life

Johnny do us a favor and check the twinslan site and see if all the documentation you received is listed. If not could you scan it and post it or send it to one of us to do it for you. We will send it back.

Regarding the units from Toledo Jim mentioned the units at least mine still had points so I can use either one. The electronic ignition was an add on. I posted a picture when I first got my units we had never seen them prior. These units were from airports all over the country at least that's what I was told. I'm not implying yours was from there just filling you in. Look on the gen side and see if you see the Electronic ignition on the back outside.
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