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Generators & Electric Motors General Discussion Antique Generators and Old Electric Motors: Questions and answers about restoring and showing old power generation systems.

Generators & Electric Motors General Discussion

Coleman Powermate not Generating


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  #1  
Old 06-19-2019, 02:47:02 AM
poppaluv poppaluv is offline
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Default Coleman Powermate not Generating

Hello all,
. I'm afraid I do not have much background working on electrical systems-components , testing, etc.
I managed to get a PMO435005 ('05?)Subaru-powered Coleman up and running, but no juice . Ser.#G071. 00559 B 2.

I have been looking at videos and posts, but quite frankly, that has been a waste of time.

Other than info for this specific model, I also have 2 other gens that work at the moment and an old Onan on the way and it would sure be sweet to know where to start testing and fixing components .

Edit: I should mention I tried to flash it by turning a drill by hand first, but that's where my knowledge ends. Lol

Last edited by poppaluv; 06-19-2019 at 03:36:27 AM.
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  #2  
Old 06-19-2019, 11:18:55 AM
Railroads Railroads is online now
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not generating

The basic testing and repair procedures in the Clymer Small AC Generator Service Manual Vol 2 covers the basic procedures for testing and repair of most Coleman Powermate Generators.

Edit, I believe this is the generator you have. http://www.powermate.com/generators/...odel=PM0435003

It's no longer Coleman Powermate, They separated ways. Now it's just "Powermate." The design of the generator is still the same though.

In order to troubleshoot the generator your going to need some basic skills and equipment. Otherwise I'd recommend taking the generator to a repair shop for further troubleshooting and possible repair. Your going to need to be comfortable working around high voltage AC and DC when working on these generators. Both are lethal.

I'd say most likely you've got a bad capacitor inside the end bell or bad brushes. The capacitors are available on the internet from sources like OPE. Anytime the end bell is removed, the bearing should be cleaned and re-greased. They can and will fail, and when they do the whole generator is destroyed. Sometimes the engines can end up with a bent crankshaft when all the carnage is over.

About the end bell, Those plastic end bells are no longer available. NLA. Be kind to it and service the bearing if removing the end bell. Don't over tighten the brush screws as they can strip out and then the end bell is damaged.

Robert

Last edited by Railroads; 06-19-2019 at 12:06:48 PM.
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  #3  
Old 06-19-2019, 03:42:37 PM
poppaluv poppaluv is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Thank you for your reply. I am not uncomfortable around electronics . I understand capacitors contain residual power for instance. I also rewired my entire house after Katrina after reading the LA code book. I just had a licensed friend give me the once over 3x. Lol

It's funny because I seem to have forgotten a lot of what I learned growing up. Not sure if it's an effect from ptsd, early onset brain stuff, lr what have you, but now at 49 I have to spend all day pouring through books when as a teen I could rebuild Q-jet after q-jet and not bat an eye.

I'm really just trying to figure out the first things to check out on this model as I've never fooled around with gen repair in the past. Purchasing the manual will have to take a back burner right now. I promised the wife id replace the timing chain, intake and some other stuff on her '88 Grand wagoneer.
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Old 06-19-2019, 04:21:24 PM
Thaumaturge Thaumaturge is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Here also is a Briggs generator general service manual that explains a lot about generator repair. Hope it helps. (Download button upper right.)
Doc
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1IY9...w?usp=drivesdk
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Old 06-19-2019, 05:45:13 PM
Wayne 440 Wayne 440 is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Quote:
Originally Posted by poppaluv View Post
...ptsd, early onset brain stuff, lr what have you....at 49 I have to spend all day pouring through books when as a teen I could rebuild Q-jet after q-jet and not bat an eye...
It probably isn't any of that, just the usual CRS (Can't Remember Stuff) that comes with getting older. You think it is bad now, wait another 10 years.
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Old 06-19-2019, 09:58:51 PM
Kothe Kothe is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

bought a powermate a few years ago with no output and called coleman told the story and was told to remove the capicators and have them tested and one was bad so replaced it and it now works fine , good luck
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Old 06-19-2019, 10:26:22 PM
Railroads Railroads is online now
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne 440 View Post
It probably isn't any of that, just the usual CRS (Can't Remember Stuff) that comes with getting older. You think it is bad now, wait another 10 years.
Must be the civil version of CSR, I know it another way. Having been the type to work on stuff my whole life, I know how the OP feels. I've forgotten some of what I have learned from my earlier days. Used to have a good grasp on SMPS inverters. I've forgotten half of it. Guess part of that is lack of time for everything. Never enough hours in a day for everything I'd like to do.

The Clymer manuals can be found on Evil Bay and Amazon. Seen them on Abe Books sometimes too. Still can order them directly from Clymer. Bit expensive, But well worth their weight in gold.

If the OP feels inclined? He should make sure the brushes are at least 1/4 inch long and check the capacitor. More than likely the electrolytic capacitor has gone stale and started leaking.
The replacement issue capacitor is 220uf at 200v for the Powermate generators. I fitted one of these to my Coleman and it solved the issue. https://www.amazon.com/0034819-01-Ca.../dp/B076JJZDS3 Can't say which style rectifiers the OP' unit has??? Mine is old enough to have the two stud mount diodes which are much more durable than the Chinese silicone bridge rectifiers. If the capacitor doesn't fix, it than there is a good chance the diodes have failed.

Robert

Last edited by Railroads; 06-19-2019 at 11:11:58 PM.
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Old 06-20-2019, 11:17:32 AM
poppaluv poppaluv is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

I will be checking these all out next trip up to the country house. After wading through a dozen or so videos and exploring the diagrams for my unit I believe I can start checking the brushes, capacitors, voltage regulator and diodes.
Thank you for the suggestions.

PS. Regarding the CRS issue , my godson asked me to design and build him a moderate sound system for him car. I was sitting and just staring at paper and he asked what I was doing . I told him I was trying to figure out how to wire up his speakers (for ohms) to bridge an amp and such. He said "oh Parran that's all Greek to me." I said well apparently I forgot how to speak greek!
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Old 06-21-2019, 09:06:03 PM
tinkerman2012 tinkerman2012 is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Remove the end bell and post a picture of the regulator board. There are two versions, an older one and the newer style printed circuit board which mounts around the bearing. It's a good chance it will be a defective BU931T Darlington transistor.
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Old 06-22-2019, 02:37:05 PM
Railroads Railroads is online now
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Quote:
Originally Posted by tinkerman2012 View Post
Remove the end bell and post a picture of the regulator board. There are two versions, an older one and the newer style printed circuit board which mounts around the bearing. It's a good chance it will be a defective BU931T Darlington transistor.
Could be, But the Powermate site lists this model as not having automatic voltage regulation. Sounds like it is the typical capacitor excitation system used on several Coleman/Powermate and others.

Robert
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Old 06-22-2019, 10:32:19 PM
tinkerman2012 tinkerman2012 is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Should be able to tell by the end bell. Does it have brushes? All Colemans I've run across have avr.
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Old 06-23-2019, 12:35:42 PM
Railroads Railroads is online now
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Quote:
Originally Posted by tinkerman2012 View Post
Should be able to tell by the end bell. Does it have brushes? All Colemans I've run across have avr.
Usually Coleman 5000 watts and up have AVR's. But not all of them. I've got a 1980's 4KW unit, and it does not have any AVR. The generator uses the capacitor excitation method. My recently acquired Homelite 5KW gen also doesn't have any AVR. It too is capacitor excited.

Robert
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Old 07-27-2019, 03:02:05 AM
poppaluv poppaluv is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Finally made it up here to get some stuff ready, especially with hurricane season looming. I have an AVR. I' searching for a tester. I know. I brought one to stay here. The brushes and what I cou,d see of the slip ring looked good.
The clips that held the harness together were fighting me every step of the way!
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Old 07-29-2019, 10:24:00 PM
poppaluv poppaluv is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Ok. I got it running. wouldn't run without surging unless the choke was on. It eased up after about 5 minutes and ran better. (is that normal?)
Tested the brushes, no voltage.
L1/L2 tested 4v
R1/R2 tested 4v
L1/R1 tested 0v
I'm sort of confused. Would this mean my AVR went out on me?
Thanks
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Old 07-30-2019, 11:30:28 AM
Fred M. Fred M. is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Poppaluv-

Yes, the AVR could be bad. But before you go any further, I suggest you try a method of flashing it that has a little more "oomph" than a hand-turned drill.

Fred
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Old 07-30-2019, 11:34:26 AM
Chas183 Chas183 is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Have you tried flashing the unit?
Take a twelve volt battery. Use small gauge wire and flash the field by applying the 12 volts to the brushes while running.
Just a quick touch is all it takes.

If you have diodes check them. They have threaded bases.

Kindest Regards,
chas183
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Old 07-30-2019, 03:02:21 PM
poppaluv poppaluv is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Will try that. I'll have to run into town first.
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  #18  
Old 07-30-2019, 09:23:57 PM
poppaluv poppaluv is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

Just my luck, it wouldn't be the fix. The avr wasn't supposed to be plugged in the harness by any chance?
I haven't even look up diodes for this one yet. I'm still going to be up here for another 2 days.
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Old 07-30-2019, 10:53:12 PM
poppaluv poppaluv is offline
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Default Re: Coleman Powermate not Generating

I cannot seem to even find a part number for a diode for this gen
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