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Machine Shop and Tool Talk

Poor Quality Stuff from China, are we blaming the right people?


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  #21  
Old 01-29-2018, 05:41:30 PM
Pete Spaco Pete Spaco is offline
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Default Re: Poor Quality Stuff from China, are we blaming the right people?

I just remembered this youtube video from Adafruit.
If you don't know, a gal named Limor Fried runs a very successful NYC company that sells and manufactures lots of electronic hobbyist stuff, like Arduno, Rasperry Pi and hundreds of accessories.
She has been dealing with the Chinese for quite a while, so when she produced this video book review, I had to watch it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rAXN...XP0wNjA2MjAxNg

It was a real eye-opener for me, but also covered many topics where my suspicions were confirmed.

In my view, it's worth watching twice.

And, by the way, I don't buy all my stuff from her, but I buy a fair amount, even though their prices are higher, because of all the tutorials, forums, etc..
Some of the stuff that I do buy from her does come from China, but I know it's gonna work when I get it.

Pete Stanaitis
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  #22  
Old 01-29-2018, 05:43:37 PM
gleaner gleaner is offline
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Default Re: Poor Quality Stuff from China, are we blaming the right people?

Quote:
Originally Posted by akuna View Post
More likely some bean counter that has never used a tool demanded they make an extra nickel per tool. Then the down spiral started and they sold Craftsman. I have not been to look at the at Ace Hardware to see what they are like. Probably the same as Home Depot, Lowes, and Harbor Freight.
That is usually what happens. Someone in the bean counting department thinks they can save a dime but quality goes down. I have two good examples.
#1 The small amount of chrome that is in hydraulic cylinder shafts. On newer equipment I use old heavy black grease on the shafts during winter otherwise they will start to rust and pit. On my land leveler I have a Minneapolis-Moline cylinder on it that is over 50 years old, never had to grease it up to prevent rust as it has a lot of chrome and she has set out every day of it's life and still shines like new.
#2 Agco put cheap clamps on the turbo air intake red hoses of the new combines instead of the spring loaded ones they used a couple of years ago. Several machines had to have engines replaced under warrantee as they took in dirt and started using oil. The following year a recall was issued and the clamps were all replaced with the spring loaded ones as before. Now to save maybe $.20 per machine they spent maybe $100 or more per machine to send mechanics out to replaced the clamps on all combines not to mention the cost of the total engine replacements on the several that ate dirt and gave them notice of a problem. Now any of us could look at them and say, "that is a radiator hose clamp". But these type of decisions are left to the college boys with the degree in bean counting for the stock holders. I'll bet none of them took a pay cut for the bad decision they promoted.

Bean counters can make their recommendations but it should then pass through someone at a quality division with someone who has worked with the equipment in question and has had to make repairs on something because of a cut in quality.

Every year when planting is over I cuss the bean counters because of the pitting starting on a hydraulic cylinder shaft that isn't 3 years old yet!!
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  #23  
Old 01-29-2018, 07:32:34 PM
Pete Spaco Pete Spaco is offline
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Default Re: Poor Quality Stuff from China, are we blaming the right people?

Hello Gleaner.

I have been in many of those meetings where the bean counters are pitted against the guy "in the dirt" (me).
Unfortunately, the guy who is listening to both sides (the decision maker) all too often has his/her own stock options to consider.
And always seem to find someone who will tell them "it'll be alright".

So, guess what.

Pete Stanaitis
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  #24  
Old 01-30-2018, 02:25:31 PM
Jeff Blaney Jeff Blaney is offline
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Default Re: Poor Quality Stuff from China, are we blaming the right people?

Not sure where exactly I first heard of this theory, but somebody once claimed that nothing is in fact cheap, and that someone always "pays the price" at some point, and not just in an economic sense.

Example:
You want your cheap plastic runners? The kid putting them together in the sweat shop pays the price...., the local shoe manufacturer goes belly up because it cannot compete, U.S./Canadian line worker pays the price... you buy another pair because the first wore out, you pay the price..... that Chinese plastic contains multiple carcinogens, you and your family pay the price.... the list goes on.

---------- Post added at 01:25:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:17:34 PM ----------

Also, in reference as to why we don't repair stuff anymore, the low cost of products today is certainly a big reason but so is disposable income. People today have far more cash in hand (or shall we say debt????) that they did 50 years ago. Put simply, they have the money to spend, and spend it they will. They don't have to settle for patched jeans, repairing old television sets, or driving beat up clunker automobiles. They have the money to buy new.
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Old 01-30-2018, 05:16:16 PM
akuna akuna is offline
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Default Re: Poor Quality Stuff from China, are we blaming the right people?

My Grandmother raised 20 kids. They never had patched jeans. When they bought new overalls, they also bought some extra fabric. She would sew a false front to them and when that started to wear, it came off and they never had a patch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Blaney View Post
...Also, in reference as to why we don't repair stuff anymore, the low cost of products today is certainly a big reason but so is disposable income. People today have far more cash in hand (or shall we say debt????) that they did 50 years ago. Put simply, they have the money to spend, and spend it they will. They don't have to settle for patched jeans, repairing old television sets, or driving beat up clunker automobiles. They have the money to buy new.
Also, patched jeans are not something bad today. They pay good money for new jeans all ripped up with holes in them. My aunts and uncles would have got the belt if they walked around in cloths like that. Not sure what Grandpa would have done if he found out they paid for them!
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Old 02-01-2018, 03:11:19 PM
94ram15004x4 94ram15004x4 is offline
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Default Re: Poor Quality Stuff from China, are we blaming the right people?

I do agree with Blaney, people arent working hard for their money so they dont have any value for it. I mean it pisses me off that i worked for years at $12/ hour rebuilding semis and now only 10 years later I could be flipping burgers for that. the mentality of " this is the last ___ Ill ever need to buy " is gone.

Gleaner- You are correct. none of the engineers that failed at something had to pay for it, so it wasnt a huge deal . 2 years ago they just widened our state highway going through town. the redid the u turns and now signs are knocked over because semis have a hard time going though. they didnt make them wide enough so the trailer gets up on the curb. I bet the engineer had never even touched a truck before. And the spot that they did the 3 lane, is never where I experienced the traffic jams.
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Old 02-18-2018, 05:14:49 PM
Norton99 Norton99 is offline
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Default Re: Poor Quality Stuff from China, are we blaming the right people?

I had to laugh at the road building example as I see this every day.
With regard to poor quality stuff out of China it is all down to what is wanted and price. The Chinese make some very good quality product but you have to be aware that you get what you pay for. My personal dealings with Chinese factories is the service is fantastic and what I have ordered has exceeded my expectations but I do my research and approach several company's.
A friend could not find anyone locally even interested in making and printing T-shirts to his designs for the tourist industry. He ended up dealing with a Chinese firm that supplied good product for the first three container loads then a larger order of two containers was crap. He had a well written contract and sent them back at the suppliers expense along with a wages bill for handling and checking. He has never had a single problem for the last decade probably because the factory does not want problems or cost. Again the product is excellent. Business is business and it is importers starting with a quality product then shifting to a cheap version,(usually from a different supplier), at low quality that is the problem. Importer still charges at quality price though.
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  #28  
Old 02-23-2018, 12:48:26 PM
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Reed Engine Reed Engine is offline
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Default Re: Poor Quality Stuff from China, are we blaming the right people?

The op referred to iso 9000. I remember when that was first new. I always saw it only as a way to kill mom an pop shops so the big corporations could get it all then they lower the quality and thereís no compitition to answer them. I know of a shipment of carb parts that were so bad they returned them. Within six months the same problems came back. The nice people over there didnít know they took a ball point pen and marked the inside of every one. You guessed it.
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