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Matters Pertaining to Insurance


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  #1  
Old 08-28-2019, 07:16:56 PM
Winchester Winchester is offline
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Default Matters Pertaining to Insurance

Yes well , firstly a simple definition of insurance as I define it .

A premium is paid by a person to an insurance underwriter to ensure that any damage to the said persons property will be covered for replacement or repair.

I therefore present to all this hypothetical case ............

Two cars parked next to each other . Car A opens the door and damages the side of car B. Both owners are present and details are exchanged for insurance purposes . In due course car B has the damage repaired and the cost is covered by car B's insurance underwriter. It is commonly thought the the insurer of car B now makes a claim to recoup the cost of the repair . This takes the form of a demand that the owner of Car A makes good this cost . I now call upon my learned colleague's to offer an opinion on this matter.
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Old 08-28-2019, 08:07:11 PM
ozfarm ozfarm is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

not always

some insurance co, have a "knock" agreement, we don't claim on you and you don't claim on us
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  #3  
Old 08-28-2019, 08:14:22 PM
Vanman Vanman is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

Interesting. I had always thought the insurance of the at fault party would pay for all damages caused, and the at fault party themselves would be responsible for any and all deductibles. Unless it was an uninsured motorist, and you had an uninsured motorist rider on your policy...
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Old 08-28-2019, 08:43:55 PM
Winchester Winchester is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

Yes well it is difficult to get an answer on this . Remember if the insurer of the claimant is trying to retrieve the cost of the repair from the fault party it is only a demand and to enforce it it would no doubt be a matter for the court. In this case the at fault party could deny any involvement .
Of course if you ask a insurer this question you will not receive an answer that satisfies .
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Old 08-28-2019, 09:02:29 PM
Rusty Engines Rusty Engines is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

Not sure what Winchester is trying to say
What happens and I have done it twice now
I have had an accident the other person is at fault
I go straight to my insurance and put in a claim with all the details including if needed a police report
I pay the excess, my insurance company claims against the other car driver “letter of demand etc etc” and as soon as that is all sorted I get back the excess
If the other drive is not issued the insurance company handles it and you still could not get back your excess if the other driver has no ‘money’
BUT a small door dent which would cost less to repair that the cost of the excess
Repair it yourself and send the bill to the other driver
But even that is not so simple as you would have get a least 3 quotes and present them to the other driver before repair, the other driver might know where to go for lower cost and if this does not all work you could go to a small claims court

Last edited by Rusty Engines; 08-28-2019 at 09:04:12 PM. Reason: missing word
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  #6  
Old 08-29-2019, 12:55:22 AM
karragullengine karragullengine is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

My wife had been hit twice in our car, not bad but enough to need fixing. We notify our insurance of their details, go to an authorised repairer and end of story. Our insurance chases up the other party and we hear nothing more of it and don't pay a cent. I feel you need to change insurers.
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Old 08-29-2019, 02:32:07 AM
Winchester Winchester is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

Yes well quite so you no doubt hear no more of it . However the crux of my question is ," What right has the insurance company who is dealing with the damaged item to write a letter of demand to the person who it is alleged is at fault ?"
I am satisfied to a degree with the insurance under writer that has my business. I feel that is a game of bluff when a demand for restitution is made .
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Old 08-29-2019, 02:39:27 AM
Winchester Winchester is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

Yes well quite so you no doubt hear no more of it . However the crux of my question is ," What right has the insurance company who is dealing with the damaged item to write a letter of demand to the person who it is alleged is at fault ?"
Try asking the Insurance Ombudsman for a ruling , you will get nowhere.
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Old 08-29-2019, 04:52:32 AM
Scotty 2 Scotty 2 is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winchester View Post
I now call upon my learned colleague's to offer an opinion on this matter.
It's what the insurance company says it is. It doesn't matter what anyone else thinks.
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  #10  
Old 08-29-2019, 06:57:18 AM
cobbadog cobbadog is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

To answer your last question,
What right has the insurance company who is dealing with the damaged item to write a letter of demand to the person who it is alleged is at fault ?"
They have the right to re-coupe their losses. Otherwise premiums would rise again. There is nothing wrong with at fault drivers paying for their stuff ups.
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Old 08-30-2019, 08:04:00 AM
Rusty Engines Rusty Engines is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

** letter of demand***
Has been standard practice for many years
Sounds like you have received one ??
If you throw it in the bin the next letter will be to attend a small claims court
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Old 08-30-2019, 08:20:26 AM
Inter Bloke Inter Bloke is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

The damaged party's insurance company "will" seek damages from the culpable party, and details will be forwarded to their underwriter (if they have one) once contact has been made.

In my case (after a rear ender) I claimed on her insurance, and it cost me nothing, but I had to get a quote before the repair was done. After the quote was accepted her insurance company paid "my" repairer. If I had just had the repair done and then tried to claim then in every likelihood they would have told me to "take a funny run at a rolling doughnut" and I would have got nothing because I wouldn't have gone through the accepted procedure to claim off the offenders insurance. In my case my car was an old vehicle (1988 Jackaroo, in 2016) and only had a third party property insurance, so "my" insurer had nothing to do with the claim, but I did have to follow the accepted procedure or risk not being able to claim at all.

What cheeses me off is my step daughters car was badly damaged last week by a woman in a shopping center car park, and despite having witnesses who were able to give us a description of the vehicle and a licence number, we can not do anything because the licence number was a stolen plate and the 4WD that did the damage most likely unlicensed and uninsured and despite giving the cops the details, they are apparently "not allowed to disclose any details to us" so we will not ever get anything back !
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  #13  
Old 08-30-2019, 09:25:24 AM
rodneyt rodneyt is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

Inter Bloke,

"What cheeses me off is my step daughters car was badly damaged last week by a woman in a shopping center car park, and despite having witnesses who were able to give us a description of the vehicle and a licence number, we can not do anything because the licence number was a stolen plate and the 4WD that did the damage most likely unlicensed and uninsured and despite giving the cops the details, they are apparently "not allowed to disclose any details to us" so we will not ever get anything back !"

it is exactly that sort of situation that insurance is for, to pay for costs of damage.
because if you have no insurance, you are liable to pay all costs of damage you caused, so it does not matter what the cops cant tell you, the responsible party is still responsible for the damage, and therefore the repair cost. if they don't have insurance, they are personally liable for the lot.

get busy writing a full report of all damage and witnesses, as a separate report to whatever you already gave to police, include as many photos as possible, with full claim for all damages, and address it to the 'driver of the vehicle' and 'care of police', then give that to police, and make sure they give you a written acknowledgement receipt of the letter/report. you will probably need a covering letter addressed to the police explaining that because you don't have the offenders address, they must be responsible for delivering the claim. probably also they should have copy of claim too, as a 'correspondence' separate to the official report.

of course if there is no money to be had, as is too common,
you wont be any better off,
but you will certainly get nothing if you dont ask,
and if offender is not a declared bankrupt, they will remain liable for costs, you never know they might have some rich family bail them out.
certainly not right they get away with it.

disclaimer: i have no training in law, my understanding of the situation could be totally wrong, my opinion is possibly not even worth 2 cents. cheers Rod.
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  #14  
Old 08-30-2019, 10:34:28 AM
rodneyt rodneyt is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

"I now call upon my learned colleague's to offer an opinion on this matter."

for an opinion that is worth more than 2 cents:

Photos = worth more money than a thousand words.

from the school of hard (car) knocks:
first:
my dad did a quick tour around Oz 30 years ago, and got reversed into as he was driving thru a shopping centre carpark somewhere other side of country. only a small ding to front left mudguard, also bent headlight trim. reverser was very appologetic, exchanged details etc, said his insurance would pay for panelbeating and new headlight surround, my dad agreed he would fix it himself and send the guy a bill for costs.

2 months later, just after dad had got home, found the correct headlight surround from wreckers, and beat out ding and puttied mudguard, he gets a letter from reversers insurance company demanding payment for a big list of repairs to dings all along side of guys car from when dad alledgedly ran in to him as he was reversing out!

after spending a day recovering for the shock of the lies,
he got a second set of photos that he took of the damage soon after it happened, along some more of when he was fixing it, and the rest of car to show no other damage, wrote up his version of events, explained that only the back area with broken tail-light on their list was a result of the accident with his vehicle, included a bill for his costs, and posted it off.

he never did get the money, but he was happy enough to never hear from them again.

the photos proved his point, the damage to dads car no way could have done all that was claimed against him.

second:
i was shifting one of my spare parts cars from A to B, almost home, a bit after sunset, it was too dark to see without lights. driving along street only 3 blocks from home, spare car on large trailer behind my car, not going fast at all, a motorbike who had been following for a couple hundred metres saw a good break in traffic, and tried to overtake, but got cleaned up on a traffic island just before a side street T-junction. he was ok, but did get a few bumps and bruises and at least one broken rib, bike was unrideable, had to be picked up later. we exchange details, i went home. next car to stop took guy to hospital. he did not see island until he was accellerating beside my trailer, there was nowhere he could go except over / into it. actually i think that the island kerbing pushed his wheels back into my trailer wheels, and flipped him sideways. being back in town, my headlights were low beam, pointing downwards to the road, a back street, there was not much street lights.

next day first thing i went back and took photos of place, and traffic island,
which had the 'keep left' sign broken over flat. then went to police and made accident report.

this time only 1 month later i get letter in mail, asking if i would testify in court because biker was suing town for negligence for no working street light at that corner, broken sign on island, which he should have seen way back. Town had denied all responsibility, with reports that sign had been repaired only a week before accident, lights had not been reported as not working so no blame etc.

so i copied photos and sent my version of events to rider's lawyer.
which included a close-up photo of the broken sign post with aged rust on break, and which gave me reason for the opinion that this amount of rust indicated it had been broken for between approximately 2 and 6 months.
and included permission to get a copy of my report from police, if needed, and stated if there are any discrepancies, the police report would be more accurate as being written right after the accident with fresh memory.

next letter to me was a thank-you, and notifying that i would not be needed in court, town had dropped their defence. i dont know end result, but it seems the photos saved the day for truth.

it did gall me that the town had got their maintenance guys or at least the foreman, to make a totally false report of their maintenance. we should have let it go to court, then present the photos, and afterwards sue whoever for contempt of court / false swearing under oath, etc whatever the lawyers could find to fit. probably the town could have had a bit of 'injury-scammers' to deal with, but that is no excuse for lies on their part.

disclaimer: if these stories are worth more than 2 cents to you, note that i am only a private individual, donations are not tax deductible.

cheers Rod.
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  #15  
Old 08-30-2019, 05:55:56 PM
john gilbert john gilbert is offline
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Default Re: Matters Pertaining to Insurance

Hi Winchester and others, your Insurance Coy, has a department called the Recoveries Department, or did so 20 years ago when I was one of those Officers. My job was to chase up any unpaid debts owed to the Insurance Coy, by responsible drivers who were not insured or would not put in a claim etc. I do feel that the laws may now be different but I also feel that to put this matter to rest, why don't you call your personal Insurer and ask for the "recoveries department". I am sure you would get the correct answer there, and remember, laws are different from state to state. Solicitors generally, do not know the Law in a State they do not generally work in, so don't call them. At that time I was working on debts in N,S,W, Vic, and S.A. all these debts were due to Motor Accidents.
Cheers, John. (ps I was a Plumber before those days.)
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Old 08-31-2019, 05:04:40 PM
Darryl Darryl is offline
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Default Re: Matters Pertaining to Insurance

Arrrh yes John, you were the face panel beater. You might get a call from the ol' company to give Winchester a " friendly" visit.
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Old 08-31-2019, 08:19:15 PM
Paul Richardson Paul Richardson is offline
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Default Re: Matters Pertaining to Insurance

Tell us what happened Winchester?
Your side of it of course!
Sometimes when you are working up a nervous defense,variants of the story can be put before others,...like a kind of test run on 'believability'.
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Old 08-31-2019, 08:39:55 PM
Scotty 2 Scotty 2 is offline
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Default Re: Matters Pertaining to Insurance

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Richardson View Post
Tell us what happened Winchester?
Sometimes when you are working up a nervous defense,variants of the story can be put before others,...like a kind of test run on 'believability'.
The pub test.
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Old 09-03-2019, 07:56:32 PM
Paul Richardson Paul Richardson is offline
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Default Re: Matters Pertaining to Insurance

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Richardson View Post
Tell us what happened Winchester?
.....you are becoming conspicuous by your absence Winchester?While asking for good advice it's never really considered fair on the listener if you are reluctant to open up a little,..to clearly describe the problem!?
....who did you back into?
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Old 09-03-2019, 08:31:47 PM
Scotty 2 Scotty 2 is offline
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Default Re: ''Matters pertaining to Insurance''

Quote:
Originally Posted by Winchester View Post
if the insurer of the claimant is trying to retrieve the cost of the repair from the fault party it is only a demand and to enforce it it would no doubt be a matter for the court.
Oh Mr Goose. You didn't run into Prince Lenny's car while you were looking at the wild flowers in the Principality did you?
You never know. Lenny might be trying to milk the insurance system (and you) to pay his ever increasing tax bill. Look out for him.

On top of the letter it may say "Letter of Demand". Easiest way to tell is post a picture of the letter up here for smarter people then me to give an opinion.

There's one way to get an answer if it's a demand or if it's enforceable. Refuse to pay and take it to Court and see how you go.
Mind you, I wouldn't want to be you if you lose.

Have you actually asked what proof they have that says you had a whoopsy with another car Mr Goose?

Cheers Scott
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