Antique Tractors
[Home] - [HELP] - [Forums] - [Library] - [Photo Gallery] - [Groups] - [Classified Ads] - [Subscribe] - [Links] - [Books] - [Sponsors] -

Go Back   SmokStak > SmokStak® Old Iron and Tractor Community > Antique Steel Wheel Tractors - Old Iron Lugs and Cleats
Forgot Password? Join Us!

Notices

Antique Steel Wheel Tractors - Old Iron Lugs and Cleats Photos and information about antique steel wheeled farm tractors. This is where to find the heaviest of Old Iron tractors.

Antique Steel Wheel Tractors - Old Iron Lugs and Cleats

What is this mystery winch thing?


this thread has 56 replies and has been viewed 5711 times

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #41  
Old 10-01-2017, 04:59:38 PM
Jacob WI Jacob WI is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Kenmare, North Dakota
Posts: 244
Thanks: 894
Thanked 475 Times in 131 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

A little bump for a fresh set of eyes. Still no answers for this mystery machine. I've been showing and asking any old timer around here that may know, and you wouldn't believe how many "I've never seen anything like that before" I've got.

I'd even take any suggestions of avenues to pursue for researching this thing. It's hard to google something when you don't even know what it is. If I have an unidentified plow, at least I know it is a plow and can go from there, but I don't even know WHAT this is

And that is still assuming that all these parts are from the same machine. If the bogie wheel, and pipe with hooks are parts of something else, then we potentially have multiple mysteries on our hands
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #42  
Old 10-01-2017, 07:46:28 PM
Oilpulled Oilpulled is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Rockford, Illinois, USA
Posts: 3,763
Thanks: 10,048
Thanked 5,290 Times in 2,014 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

It is a machine to work with a pair of cables. Either the cables power the machine or the machine moves or tensions the cables. Cables pulled through it could propel it forward or backward. Or it could pull cables from forward or back direction. You need to determine if the steering wheel and the long pipe with scraper levers are part of it.
Is it located near any old project as mining, construction, excavating, dredging or canal building?
Good luck with the mystery.
Ed
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Oilpulled For This Post:
  #43  
Old 10-07-2017, 11:13:20 PM
Jacob WI Jacob WI is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Kenmare, North Dakota
Posts: 244
Thanks: 894
Thanked 475 Times in 131 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

I got the mystery machine hauled home this afternoon. So now I can look it over at my leisure and see if I can come up with any more clues to its origin. I'll try to get another video tomorrow of some of the details to see if it sparks any more ideas from you all.

Looks like I saved this stuff just in time too. The entire farm site had been bulldozed. House, all the tree rows, everything. All that is left is two huge piles of trees to be burned this winter. It is really kind of sad how history can be erased so quickly like that. They were loading up the huge bulldozer and leaving as I finished up loading the mystery machine. They had only added a few pieces of junk metal to my pile of machinery, so I think it is safe to say that the other drive wheel, and whatever else was part of this machine is long gone, as it was not on the farm site anywhere.

Once I got it home I hosed it off a bit tonight to get some of the dirt and weeds off of it, and it MAY have been either red or orange? There is basically no paint left, but I see a few tiny bits that hint at the red or orange color.

Ed, to my knowledge the only thing out here on your suggestion list is coal mining. At least back in the day there was more of that from what I hear. I was talking with an old farmer a few weeks back and he told me that there was a steam engine that was driven into a mine out here in the old days and buried to get rid of it. I should dig into that story a bit more out of curiosity, but I digress...

Any possible mining connection?
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Jacob WI For This Post:
  #44  
Old 10-08-2017, 09:30:21 AM
CharlieB CharlieB is offline
Registered-I
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Severn, Maryland, USA
Posts: 225
Thanks: 16
Thanked 101 Times in 77 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

This thing aroused my curiosity, and I have been all over the internet trying to figure out what it was. I still don't know. A few observations though....
I think we can rule out anything winch related, or heavy duty. The supports for the gear trains are very light. The gear train input revolution is about four times faster than the drive wheel revolution. The smaller pulleys are radiused at the edges to receive cables. The large pulleys (if that's what they are) are flat bottomed, suggesting that something other than cables passed over them. Based on the shape of the guards over the larger pulleys, it's hard to imagine how any belt, or flat chain, or cable could be routed over them. ???? The "handles" for operating the independent forward/reverse on each side of the machine look like they're drilled to receive other mechanical parts. The reversing linkages also have pulleys on them, suggesting that they were somehow cable operated. I'm envisioning a machine with two separate mechanical actions coordinated by control cables. It looks like the machine is right-side-up as found, based on the length of the "handles" on the gear controls. If so, then the right/left castings you found near the wheels indicate that the drive wheels were at the rear of the machine, and this was not a push hitch setup. The small, loose wheel with the attached sector gear has a very sharp edge, which would seem to be wrong for field crops, but better suited to row crops. The spacing of the rear wheels also looks appropriate for row crops. Again, pure speculation here; I was unable to find any machine that remotely resembled this one.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to CharlieB For This Post:
  #45  
Old 10-08-2017, 11:55:43 AM
mschreiber mschreiber is offline
Registered-III
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: crown point ind. or plymouth ma.
Posts: 1,459
Thanks: 2,531
Thanked 937 Times in 472 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

2 me it looks to heavy built for crop use. Maybe some kind construction thing. With narrow frame i can't get tiling trencher outa my thinking. This 1 is horse drawn.



https://books.google.com/books/conte...2%2C435&edge=0

Last edited by mschreiber; 10-08-2017 at 12:08:08 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to mschreiber For This Post:
  #46  
Old 10-08-2017, 03:42:48 PM
Jacob WI Jacob WI is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Kenmare, North Dakota
Posts: 244
Thanks: 894
Thanked 475 Times in 131 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

Thanks for all the input guys, I think we are creating more questions than answers, but that is ok. Sooner or later we'll figure this out!

I took another video today of all the pieces that I have. I apologize for the windy audio, but this is ND, if it is not windy something is wrong.

I know I originally was leaning away from this being any type of tractor, but lately I have been going back towards that idea. Maybe this was some type of motor cultivator or motor plow unit? Like the Square Turn that was suggested earlier. Or similar units like the Hackney Auto Plow, Opsata Motor Plow, etc...

Here is a link to some of these strange units:
http://vieilles-soupapes.grafbb.com/...urs-americains

This mystery machine definitely has similarities to these types of units, but nothing is identical.

Probably a long shot, but could this be some type of prototype unit? I'm starting to wonder about the theory of a bunch of kids putting together stuff from a scrap pile mentioned earlier, but that still doesn't explain WHAT the parts were from originally though.

Here is the video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1I_L...ature=youtu.be
Grrrr I don't know why I can never get the video to embed on this site
Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Jacob WI For This Post:
  #47  
Old 10-08-2017, 11:45:04 PM
halcon halcon is offline
Registered-II
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Fillmore, Saskatchewan, Canada
Posts: 852
Thanks: 1,972
Thanked 1,249 Times in 558 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

Thanks for a very interesting thread. I'm leaning toward this being a hay stacker. I think when built it was quite wide---- maybe 12 feet or more and could have had 2 tiller wheels. That pipe you have could be part of the basket trip. I googled hay stacker and there is pix of similar machines. And no doubt there were many different makes of them, we just have to find the right one. That little front plate you removed looks to be a lashup so it could be the narrowness was leading us astray.

---------- Post added at 08:23:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:58:20 PM ----------

There is a video of a team of horses on a similar machine titled, hay stacking-you tube

---------- Post added at 08:51:02 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:23:38 PM ----------

I would like to bring a link to that video over here, it is Cottel Clydesdales stacking hay.

---------- Post added at 09:45:04 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:51:02 PM ----------

Can't figure out how to do it
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to halcon For This Post:
  #48  
Old 10-09-2017, 08:54:50 AM
mschreiber mschreiber is offline
Registered-III
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: crown point ind. or plymouth ma.
Posts: 1,459
Thanks: 2,531
Thanked 937 Times in 472 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

Cottel Clydesdales stacking hay.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYgJEWAHEOY

2 me its still 2 heavy built for a hay stacker, stackers steered by "gee" and "haw" command to the horses. Russell road equipment was painted red/maroon.

Last edited by mschreiber; 10-09-2017 at 09:08:00 AM.
Reply With Quote
The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to mschreiber For This Post:
  #49  
Old 10-09-2017, 09:52:31 AM
halcon halcon is offline
Registered-II
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Fillmore, Saskatchewan, Canada
Posts: 852
Thanks: 1,972
Thanked 1,249 Times in 558 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

It has just what it needs to preform all the functions of that style of a stacker. Someone with interests in horse machinery might have information about other makes of stackers other than the Jay Hawk. All so the cable drums and sheaves are in a proper position for that use. We need to remember it has suffered some modifications, and has a lot missing which some no doubt were wooden parts. Ha, may be some one started to narrow it up to make a horse powered front end loader. Tracking down decendence of a family that where on that farm back in the day might produce more information.
Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to halcon For This Post:
  #50  
Old 10-10-2017, 10:29:02 PM
halcon halcon is offline
Registered-II
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Fillmore, Saskatchewan, Canada
Posts: 852
Thanks: 1,972
Thanked 1,249 Times in 558 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

The encyclopedia of American farm implements & antiques lists over 70 different makes and trade names of hay stackers. As well there is a jay hawk ad that mentions a large 4 horse model but sorry no picture.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to halcon For This Post:
  #51  
Old 10-15-2017, 01:55:18 PM
GSStomp GSStomp is offline
Registered
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Griffin, Saskatchewan, Canada
Posts: 2
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

There is an assumption that is all from the same piece of equipment. If it is a scrap pile it could be from multiple pieces.

---------- Post added at 11:55:18 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:31:16 AM ----------

A hay sweep most likely would not have a 4 ft ground drive wheel.That would be kinda too much for the horses. Kinda overkill for moving hay, maybe earth. Maybe some kind of elevating scraper or earth moving equipment.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to GSStomp For This Post:
  #52  
Old 10-16-2017, 11:27:39 AM
Jacob WI Jacob WI is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Kenmare, North Dakota
Posts: 244
Thanks: 894
Thanked 475 Times in 131 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GSStomp View Post
There is an assumption that is all from the same piece of equipment. If it is a scrap pile it could be from multiple pieces.

---------- Post added at 11:55:18 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:31:16 AM ----------

A hay sweep most likely would not have a 4 ft ground drive wheel.That would be kinda too much for the horses. Kinda overkill for moving hay, maybe earth. Maybe some kind of elevating scraper or earth moving equipment.
No, we do not know for sure this is all from the same piece. It was not in a scrap pile though, per say. It was just this stuff piled together, not with other scrap. In fact there was no other scrap on the farm, which led me to think this MAY have all been from one piece of machinery, but anything is possible.

I too am not 100% convinced it is a hay stacker, because of the heaviness of the piece. In real life this stuff is even heaver than it looks in pics. To put it in perspective, the steer wheel was about all I could do to get it in the back of the truck by myself. It's HEAVY.

Some type of earth moving equipment, or elevating scraper is plausible to me though

And like I said before, even if it is multiple pieces of equipment, that just means multiple mysteries, as this had to come from something originally

As far as tracking down previous family members with history of this farm, that is probably a long shot. The current owners have had this place since at least the 80's, so any of the original farmers that may have known what this came from may well be gone? But I can check into it when I get a chance.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Jacob WI For This Post:
  #53  
Old 10-16-2017, 09:41:13 PM
halcon halcon is offline
Registered-II
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Fillmore, Saskatchewan, Canada
Posts: 852
Thanks: 1,972
Thanked 1,249 Times in 558 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

[QUOTE=Jacob WI;

I too am not 100% convinced it is a hay stacker, because of the heaviness of the piece. In real life this stuff is even heaver than it looks in pics. To put it in perspective, the steer wheel was about all I could do to get it in the back of the truck by myself. It's HEAVY.
If this happens to be from a stacker that is larger than the Jay Hawk in the video, possibly a 4 horse model, a bit of counter weight in the tail end would be most welcome. One wonders what would happen if the operator stepped of the machine in the video when the basket is about 1/2 way up. Compared to the weight of say a loaded manure spreader, or a grain tank load of wheat, or a dump wagon load of clay. This machine would not be too heavy for the job with a good team or 4 horses
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to halcon For This Post:
  #54  
Old 11-03-2017, 06:21:58 PM
Jacob WI Jacob WI is offline
Subscriber
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Kenmare, North Dakota
Posts: 244
Thanks: 894
Thanked 475 Times in 131 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

The mystery continues. I did finally get myself a copy of Wendel's Encyclopedia of American Farm Tractors, as I didn't have this in my collection yet. I went through this entire book cover to cover looking for something with any similarities to my mystery machine. No dice. There is a LOT of cool and obscure tractors in there though. I'll have to get the American Farm Implements and Antiques next I guess. One can always use more good reference materials right?

So I'm back leaning towards the fact that it is not a tractor of any sort, but rather something else.

This doesn't help any to the mystery, but I am still thinking about it in the back of my mind. Let it percolate long enough and something may come up. I'll walk by it every day in my back yard, at least until spring now....
Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Jacob WI For This Post:
  #55  
Old 11-03-2017, 07:44:10 PM
Phil Johnson's Avatar
Phil Johnson Phil Johnson is offline
Sponsor
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Tofield, AB Canada
Posts: 1,956
Thanks: 5,562
Thanked 3,433 Times in 1,100 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

Might make a nice piece of "yard art", Jacob.
__________________
It'll be done in good time---impossible might take a little longer!
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Phil Johnson For This Post:
  #56  
Old 11-04-2017, 12:43:49 PM
Oilpullman Oilpullman is offline
Registered-III
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Osage, Iowa, USA
Posts: 238
Thanks: 569
Thanked 400 Times in 98 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

Part of a coal elevator used for unloading train cars?
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 11-04-2017, 03:33:22 PM
NDmeterman NDmeterman is offline
Registered-I
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Sioux Falls, South Dakota
Posts: 243
Thanks: 694
Thanked 395 Times in 133 Posts
Default Re: What is this mystery winch thing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilpullman View Post
Part of a coal elevator used for unloading train cars?
There were some early lignite mines in northwestern ND so that sounds like a very reasonable guess.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to NDmeterman For This Post:
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

F o r u m Jump

Similar Threads Chosen at Random
Thread Thread Starter F o r u m Replies Last Post
Lorrys' new winch cobbadog Smokstak Down Under 6 07-09-2015 02:16:52 AM
Help Identify Winch looking thing Dustin D Ehli Farm + Industrial Antiques and Collectibles 5 07-10-2011 06:06:52 PM
Hydraulic Winch Gary A. Craig Trucks, Trailers and Hauling for Shows 2 03-30-2010 09:02:28 PM
Need help with winch JHFoster Antique Marine Engines and Outboard Motors 1 10-22-2009 03:53:20 PM
Look at my Olds 8 hp and winch Tom Guinn Antique Gas Engine Discussion 24 09-26-2008 09:05:06 PM


Use "Ctrl" mouse wheel to change screen size.
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:18:18 AM.

Smokstak and Enginads site search!


All use is subject to our TERMS OF SERVICE
SMOKSTAK® is a Registered Trade Mark - A Community of Antique Engine Enthusiasts
Copyright © 2000 - 2016 by Harry Matthews P.O. Box 5612 - Sarasota, FL 34277