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Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...


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  #1  
Old 01-08-2010, 11:30:33 PM
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Talking Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

i have been watching , with interest, the News, from your part of the World, concerning the Collision and sinking of the SeaSheperd Vessel by a Japanese Whaler. I have formed my opinion, already, but I just got to thinking, since this is in you Folks backyard, that I would like to hear your opinions. You can post here, PM "Me" directly, or eMail "Me" <****path@btpost.net> Replace "****" with "fast".... Thanks in advance,

Bruce in alaska Asst. Chief Moderator
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  #2  
Old 01-09-2010, 12:14:50 PM
Jimmie Bee Jimmie Bee is offline
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Default Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

It would seem that the SeaShephard may have been where it didn't belong and brakes on the whaler may have failed. LOL.Personally, I sometimes wish all the whales would be eliminated and we wouldn't hear about all the rhetoric anymore. In all seriousness, perhaps Bob Barker should have spent his $5M, for the ships replacement, on all his women. The whales are legal where they are hunted. Most animal rights groups have the outlawing of ALL hunting as their ultimate goal.
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Old 01-09-2010, 11:39:19 PM
Walky Walky is offline
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Thumbs down Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

l don't believe much of what either side says really.
The truth is always somewhere in the middle of the PR crap. :

The Sea Shepard:
1. Deliberately placing your smaller & faster ships in harms way to force a change of course by the whaling ship is reckless.
2. Releasing ropes designed to tear propellers out of ships to sink them. If you play chicken often enough you will get hurt.
3. Releasing bogus language translations that make the crash appear deliberate.
A bunch of squealers.

Japanese Whalers:
1. Turning water cannons on a ship and crew in distress - a low act.
2. The Scientific Research excuse for the whaling is Bull Sh!t.
1000 whales a year and no significant published data.
3. Most of the meat gets sold for dog food.
The Japanese government diverts attention from their other fishing practices by persisting with whaling.

Australian Government:
All talk and no action on this dog fight in our declared sanctuary and territories - Where is the action promised in the International Court?
Trying to play both sides against the middle as usual

One man's opinion of course
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Old 01-10-2010, 01:35:24 AM
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Sam Hamilton Sam Hamilton is offline
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Default Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

Interesting thread that seems to have missed the mainstream news up here. Still good to know what is out there in the world (years ago I was out in that direction).
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Old 01-10-2010, 11:44:22 PM
jopeter jopeter is offline
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Default Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

What Walky has previously said I would agree with but the Japs are in Australian waters and should not be there and if they pissed off the problem might go away. The notion that it is for scientific purposes is absolute bull shit and it is a disgrace that it goes on . I live in a town that is regularly visited by whales on their way north to breed and their return south to the arctic . I recently went to a very isolated beach here on the south coast of West Australia .As I drove over the last sandhill before the beach we saw 10 whales and their young breaching and putting on a great display .no more than 100 metres from the shore....the best part of it was the fact that only my wife and myself winessed this ,no one else there !
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Old 01-11-2010, 04:06:05 AM
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Default Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

If I had any say, those Jap whalers would be floating match sticks once they came past the top of new Guinea

Last edited by Oldsiron; 01-11-2010 at 06:13:18 AM.
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Old 01-12-2010, 09:01:26 AM
Anton van der Cruijsen Anton van der Cruijsen is offline
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Default Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

The opinion of Walky, is also my opinion!

Anton
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Old 01-12-2010, 06:13:24 PM
jopeter jopeter is offline
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Default Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

Anton....not sure what your opinion is. If you are agreeing with Walky that is OK but Walky sees it three ways and has not made a specific claim as to who is to blame.
I still stand by my opinion that if the Japs were not in our waters the incident may not have happend .
Bruce says that the Skipper of the Sea Shepherd boat is not a qualified ''Master'' .This may well be correct but consider this ,a qualified ''Master'' would not be harassing a vessel that is tresspasing in our waters , so it has to be a maverick skipper and good luck to him .
I make it clear that I support the Sea Shepherd and bugger the japs.
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Old 01-14-2010, 04:22:11 AM
Rusty Engines Rusty Engines is offline
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Default Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

Hi Bruce I can see what you are trying to say ‘who has right-a-way’ down the corner where the stop sign is BUT I think you are missing what is going on
People right around the world ‘PROTEST’ against many many different things, have not heard of people standing in front of a bulldozer (who do you think would win) to save a tree and the list goes on and on
Look what happened in China a few odd years back were one person stood in front of an army tank and stoped it
Do you agree with everything your government does including your local council/government I think not and you protest at least by writing a letter to your local newspaper
The USA has had one of the biggest protest in the world over the right to own a slave and it got to a point where you had a internal war, the north against the south and if you were alive back then you would of been standing in front of a gun on one side or the other thinking your side is right
This is what you are missing the right to protest, and the Steve Irwin took on a Japanese vessel and lost.
Most Australians agree with the protest at stopping the Japanese whaling and I fill sure if the Japanese were a lot closer to the Australian main land there would have been lots of small boats in front of the Japanese and it would be to hell with who has or has not the right away on the sea
Ian
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Old 01-11-2010, 05:42:53 AM
Anton van der Cruijsen Anton van der Cruijsen is offline
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Default Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

Hi Bruce,
I would like to hear YOUR opinion now!
Regards,
Anton
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  #11  
Old 01-11-2010, 09:47:33 PM
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Talking Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

Ok, I look at this, and formed my Opinion, solely on the basis of Maritime Seamanship and Safe Navigation of Vessels on the High Seas, and The International Rules of the Road For Navigation of Vessels on the High Seas. I took the Vids, Published by SeaSheperds, on their Website, AND Vids published by the Japanese by their Information Ministry. All the rest of it, is of little or NO consequence, when it comes down to the BASIC Question of the events leading up to and just after the collision. To try and justify one position or the other, by bringing up Whaling, and its Legality, and the Australian Claim on the Waters where this collision happened, is besides the Point, and just trying to Blow Smoke and Mirrors, on the cause and responsibility for the Collision. I AM a Maritime Radioman and have Testified in Admiralty Courts, as well as a reTired US Federal Agent, formally with the Federal Communications Commission, here in the US.

So, with the above stated, I believe that the Seasheperd vessel that was in the collision, was piloted by an Ignorant Dufus, and his total lack of following the International Rules of the Road for Safe Vessel Navigation on the High Seas, was the cause, DIRECTLY, and indirectly, of the Collision between the two vessels. International Rules of the Road SAY the following Conventions apply to this case.

1. When, two vessels of Greatly differing Sizes and Maneuverability, approach and collision is imminent, it is REQUIRED that the smaller and more maneuverable Vessel give Way to the larger less maneuverable vessel, even if the smaller vessel, technically, has the Right of Way, under another Rule. (This is the same reason that Power Vessels MUST give Way to Sail Powered Vessels under ALL circumstances. Power vessels are more maneuverable than sailing vessels, while under sail.)
2. When two vessels approach, with one vessel overtaking the other, It is the overtaking vessel that MUST navigate so as to stay clear of the overtaken vessel, AND avoid collision in ALL circumstances. The Overtaken Vessel is required to maintain course and speed until the overtaking has been completed and the vessels are no longer in proximity, and the danger of collision has passed. (None of these rules would REQUIRE the Master of the Japanese Vessel to put his vessel in Harms Way, just to keep to the Rules of the Road)
3. When Collision is Imminent, it is required that BOTH vessels maneuver to AVOID the Collision, by ANY and ALL Means.

So now to the VID's and what they show.

The Japanese Vid clearly shows the smaller vessel, coming up from astern, on the Starboard side of the Japanese Vessel, and getting pelted by a water cannon. The smaller vessel then continues to advance at a greater pace up along the Starboard side, and it shines a Green Laser at the Japanese Wheelhouse, and along the decks of the Japanese Vessel, and is then pelted with a water cannon again.
As the smaller vessel approaches the Bow of the larger vessel, the smaller vessel speeds up, to get in front the bow wake of the larger vessel. (Clearly seen by more wake from its stern) It then cuts power and makes a hard turn to Port, under the larger vessels BOW, and is lost from sight. It is next seen being washed down the Starboard Side of the Japanese vessel, minus a BIG Chunk, of its Bow.

The SeaSheperd VID posted on their Website, and taken from a sister ship out in front of the two vessels in question and looking back at the two vessels BOW on, shows what happened just as the smaller vessel is lost from Sight by the Japanese vessels Vid. It shows the larger Vessel, in fairly heavy Seas, making slightly more than headway, but pitching significantly in the prevailing Seas. As the smaller vessel cuts in front of the larger vessel, the larger vessel pitches to the Starboard, as the bow rises on a wave, the smaller vessel, puts on a LOT more power, to try and clear the pitching Bow of the Larger Vessel, as seen by a LOT More wake at its stern, but there just isn't enough time to avoid the collision, and the larger vessels bow crushes into the smaller vessel, and servers a good portion of its bow. The majority of the smaller vessel gets washed down the Starboard side of the Larger vessel. After the collision, the Japanese vessel is seen turning hard over to Port, to keep clear of the stern end of the smaller vessel.

So, who's fault is it? Given the Rules of the Road, above... You tell "Me"....
Considering that None of the Seasheperd Skippers have ever held ANY type of Master License from ANY Country, and their vessels are ALL registered as non-Commercial Private Vessels, that my Grandson can pilot legally. (He is three years old) If I was the Investigating or Presiding Officer in any Admiralty Court on this incident, The SeaSheperd skipper would find him /her self in the BRIG, FOREVER, and the vessel Owners REQUIRED to pay a VERY large fine for allowing such an Incompetent Boob to pilot their vessel.

But that is just "Me", and your milage may vary......
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Old 01-12-2010, 03:22:49 AM
Walky Walky is offline
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Default Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

You are 100% Right!! Great analysis of the collision.
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Old 01-12-2010, 06:38:10 AM
jopeter jopeter is offline
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Default Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

Bruce , thank you for your version and vedict of the affair . You may well be correct your lengthy C.V. tells us that you can certainly give a qualified opinion but the whole idea of the Sea Shepherd being there is to harrass the Japs who should not be there . I guess in a cat and mouse game that they are playing the smaller vessel is going to come of worse .
I dont have any particular axe to grind with the Japs except that their versions of events do not always tell the truth . Yes the Sea Shepherd vessel took a risk and it did not pay off .
I dont agree with the killing of whales in our waters .
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Old 01-16-2010, 07:26:24 AM
Graeme.R Graeme.R is offline
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Default Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

hi first time user so hope this works!!!!!! typical aussies stealing kiwis territory ..... in our local rag that japs are going too be taken to court presumably!!!!!!!! no firm opinion just seems a lot of lies on both sides
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Old 01-16-2010, 03:16:39 PM
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Talking Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

The last that has been heard over on this side of the Pond, is that SeaSheperds have filed a "Claim" in the Hague World Court, but that is not likely to go anywhere, as those are usually filed by Member States, and only Member States have traction there. Usually in Maritime Disputes, this would be done by the Flag Nations of the vessels involved. I am not aware of, in which Nation, the ADY Gil was Registered, and Flagged. From what I can see, the Japanese are NOT filing any Actions, in the Hague, over this incident.
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Old 01-17-2010, 07:54:45 AM
Graeme.R Graeme.R is offline
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Default Re: Would like an Opinion from my Down-Under Friends...

gday. as far as i can remember the ady gil first went around the world as a floating advert for bio diesel , had an accident over your side of the pond ,serious from memory..sure it was originally built in nz so will be flagged here..nz govt sending scientists to do studies on whales to show japs you dont have too kill them to study them,using some type of weapon that only takes small samples from outer skin and blubber...had a mate over your way doing the same with your wolves.( your govt studies )... shooting a net capture gun from a helicopter........................all the best
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