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Synthetic Oil thoughts


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  #11  
Old 07-07-2013, 11:27:56 AM
David C David C is online now
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Default Re: Syn Oil thoughts

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There's a place in San Antonio, "something Research" that does engineering studies for practically everybody that is big enough to afford them.
The place in San Antonio is Southwest Research Institute. I looked at there careers website and it looks like they have some interesting jobs for gear heads.


David C.
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  #12  
Old 07-07-2013, 11:35:22 AM
Leon N. Leon N. is offline
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Default Re: Syn Oil thoughts

To me this is one of the most important aspects of maintain a reliable standby generator. So I would like to share with you my experiences with an Onan 705JB from 1970, now some 43 years and still on line as a very reliable standby power source. So here goes.

I purchased my JB in 1970. It was built in 1966 and run strictly on propane and was usable when I got it. However, I tore it down to a short block and had to replace the exhaust valves and guides mainly because there was no lubrication to the upper valve chamber. I also noticed I could still see the honing marks in the cylinders, a testimony in part to the use of gaseous fuel, namely propane.

For the first few years, I followed the Onan oil recommendations very closely. BTW, Onan told me that 90 % of the engine wear occurred in the first 15 minutes of operation. Something to keep in mind wrt cold weather operation. So I installed a heater but discontinued use after a couple of winters because it resulted in condensation problems developing in the lube oil.

So when synthetic oil came on the market I investigated using a very low viscosity version in my JB. I was concerned about two things. Adequate start up cold temp lubrication and also high temperature lubrication. I talked to the Mobile tech support about synthetic oil film strength and lubrication qualities at high engine operating temperatures. They mention that Mobile 1 synthetic will work as advertised up to 400 degrees. And that the oil two main jobs is maintaining film strength and cooling.

I installed a temp gage on the JB sump and it never gets above about 250 degrees even on the hottest days.

So I have been using Mobile 1 5W20 for many years now because of the reasons stated above - and - I am further convinced because our 2007 Honda civic recommends 5W20 synthetic all year round and that is a more severe temp environment than what my JB is exposed to.

In my opinion, one does not need to use a heavy weight oil unless the clearances between the moving parts, specifically the journals is opening up due to excessive wear. The other consideration as to how frequently to change the JB oil depends of the use profile and the type of fuel being used. Note, the Onan recommendations, I think, were determined by the fact that leaded gasoline was one of the primary fuels back in the 60's. My JB runs on natural gas. I make sure each time it starts, it runs long enough to drive the moisture out of the lube oil. I average about 1 hour per month of run time and change the oil about every two years.

Leon
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  #13  
Old 02-10-2014, 12:36:34 PM
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Default Re: Syn Oil thoughts

Would there be any concern about the ability of the oil seals in our Onans to perform properly with semi-synthetic or synthetic oil?

John
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Old 02-10-2014, 12:57:01 PM
John Ward John Ward is offline
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Default Re: Syn Oil thoughts

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Originally Posted by RETCPO View Post
Oil used in YOUR generator is your choice...
Make YOUR choice wisely.
Most of the generators discussed here are of the older flat tappet cam and lifter design these live longer when an additive ZDDP is in the oil you use.
Here are some links for your reading pleasure.

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c3-t...ppet-oils.html

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/...t_Engines.aspx

http://www.chevelles.com/forums/showthread.php?t=243928

http://www.cam-shield.com/acatalog/FAQ.html

The final decision of which oil you use is yours... Chose wisely!
This is what concerns me with using synthetic oils.
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Old 02-10-2014, 01:20:37 PM
Ted_Cool Ted_Cool is offline
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Default Re: Syn Oil thoughts

I run Mobil 1 0W-30 with 4 ounces of Red Line 81403 Break-in Oil Additive with Zinc added.

Starts great, runs great, and I don't worry so much about the cam and lifters.

Oil is like religion - everyone has their own idea of what's right.

I hope all of our different points of view help you make a decision you're happy with.

It's hard to go too far wrong with any modern oil these days.

Good luck!
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Old 02-12-2014, 08:31:19 PM
sitkablacktail sitkablacktail is offline
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Default Re: Syn Oil thoughts

I have a 6DJB and run almost everyday, 7 hours yesterday, it is my power source along w/ solar-batt. I am currently using Valvoline 5W-40 synthetic. Most likely run it year round here in Alaska, south central. Cold weather starting issues, I ran standard oil before and she would not start w/ two batteries! Google; Bob is the oil guy motor oil 101, It is a lengthy read but very informative, his website is all about lube. Never knew people could discuss so much about oil!
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Old 02-13-2014, 12:46:44 AM
Jim Marcozzi Jim Marcozzi is offline
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Default Re: Syn Oil thoughts

Keep in mind that synthetic oil's molecular structure is smaller than "regular" oil and because of this, it's more prone to leak. Many a classic car owner has put synthetic oil in their perfectly sealed car and now leaks because the oil can slip through small imperfections much easier because of its smaller structure.
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Old 02-13-2014, 09:13:19 AM
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J. McNugget J. McNugget is offline
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Default Re: Syn Oil thoughts

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Originally Posted by Jim Marcozzi View Post
Keep in mind that synthetic oil's molecular structure is smaller than "regular" oil and because of this, it's more prone to leak. Many a classic car owner has put synthetic oil in their perfectly sealed car and now leaks because the oil can slip through small imperfections much easier because of its smaller structure.
Thanks Jim. That's the type of an answer I was hoping for. My Onans are not spring chickens, so I don't want to bring problems on myself.

John
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Old 02-13-2014, 10:10:39 AM
Ted_Cool Ted_Cool is offline
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Default Re: Syn Oil thoughts

I recall that one of the explanations about why engines seem to develop leaks after switching to synthetic oil is due to the better cleaning ability of the synthetic oil.

Old deposits of gunk get removed. The gunk was often built up around seal areas.

It can also be that your engine is just that much older each time you change the oil.

The good news is that if your crank case breather is working correctly, your crank case is under a slight vacuum, so any potential leaks are prevented.

That being said, a good dino oil will work just fine.
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Old 02-13-2014, 12:12:37 PM
Leon N. Leon N. is offline
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Default Re: Syn Oil thoughts

Jim Marcozzi I believe you are correct about syn oil being more prone to leaks. I am not a purest so a little seepage does not bother me. I believe in my case there is some seepage from the push rod drain tubes. However, the oil consumption is very very low and it does not bother me. Besides it discourages those little critters from looking for a new home.

I do not believe there is any sludge formation with syn oil in my JB. The oil has superior lubricating properties under both cold and hot operation. I always get the JB up to operating temperature each time it is started and make sure it runs for at least 30 minutes.
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