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Antique Gas Engine Discussion

Fairbanks Morse, 1.5 horse, throttle governed rebuild


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  #1  
Old 02-03-2019, 01:56:52 PM
davebrode davebrode is offline
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Default Fairbanks Morse, 1.5 horse, throttle governed rebuild

Hello All,

Long time lurker here, I'm working on this engine for my employer/friends.
1919, sn 368615.

The head is cracked [looks like freeze damage to me] From the lack of bearing, crankshaft, valve guide, wrist pin and cylinder bore wear, I believe that it didn't have much use prior to being stored.

The issue with this head isn't so much that it's cracked, but the seats are rusted away, especially the exhaust seat. It sat for decades covered up with a stack of burlap bags. I'm going to try to cut a new seat, but it looks like there isn't enough mat'l left. An ebay seller has one that has good seats, but it's cracked on top like mine, but also on the bottom. The weld job is horrible.

The piston is really nice, but the bore is pitted badly. I see no reference to oversized pistons. If I can't find something suitable, I'll have it sleeved back to std.

The rotating contactor in the ignitor is stuck. There's an issue with the little brass cover on the shaft side. it's loose and just flops around.

Question: Are these engines a ZB? I've looked and looked, and I've found pictures or videos on just four besides this one.

Thanks for any advice,
Dave
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  #2  
Old 02-03-2019, 03:30:47 PM
joder joder is offline
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Default Re: Fairbanks Morse, 1.5 horse, throttle governored rebuild.

Yes - it's basically an earliest 1 1/2 hp ZB with a head. It's a 1919 plugoscillator. Try looking up old threads on that engine. This was a short-lived transitional engine, bridging from the little headless with low tension ignition and the bosch (AB-33) high-tension later engines with heads.

I personally would try fixing what you have - these little engines are uncommon. The cracks can be welded or lock-n-stitched and new cast iron (or steel) seats can be cut-in at the extreme end of that method. There have been a few decent replacement heads over the last year or 2 show up on eBay so you can go that way, too if you don't mind waiting a little. In either method, prepare to pay more for the head work or new head than what you have in the rest of the engine.
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Old 02-03-2019, 04:04:55 PM
Kirk Taylor Kirk Taylor is offline
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Default Re: Fairbanks Morse, 1.5 horse, throttle governored rebuild.

Quote:
Originally Posted by davebrode View Post
Hello All,

Long time lurker here, I'm working on this engine for my employer/friends.
1919, sn 368615.

The head is cracked [looks like freeze damage to me] From the lack of bearing, crankshaft, valve guide, wrist pin and cylinder bore wear, I believe that it didn't have much use prior to being stored.

The issue with this head isn't so much that it's cracked, but the seats are rusted away, especially the exhaust seat. It sat for decades covered up with a stack of burlap bags. I'm going to try to cut a new seat, but it looks like there isn't enough mat'l left. An ebay seller has one that has good seats, but it's cracked on top like mine, but also on the bottom. The weld job is horrible.

The piston is really nice, but the bore is pitted badly. I see no reference to oversized pistons. If I can't find something suitable, I'll have it sleeved back to std.

The rotating contactor in the ignitor is stuck. There's an issue with the little brass cover on the shaft side. it's loose and just flops around.

Question: Are these engines a ZB? I've looked and looked, and I've found pictures or videos on just four besides this one.

Thanks for any advice,
Dave
I am one for repairing the parts that are there. If there is enough metal under the seats, you can bore out the old seats and install inserts. The crack is an easy fix. The sleeving isn't a big deal either. It's just a matter of setting up and doing it, or paying someone else to do it.
That's a scarce engine; it would be nice to do it right.
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Old 02-03-2019, 04:21:39 PM
davebrode davebrode is offline
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Default Re: Fairbanks Morse, 1.5 horse, throttle governored rebuild.

Hello Gents,

I'm embarrassed, as I just realize that it is the intake seat that I'm worried about, not the exhaust. I'll attach a pic of a head [not mine]. There isn't much material in the area where the seat meets the passage to the ignitor. No way that a seat insert would work.

btw, this is a family heirloom, in the family since new. I'll do my best.

Thanks so much.
Dave
p.s. - how many years was the 1.5h ZB manufactured?
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Old 02-03-2019, 04:27:46 PM
joder joder is offline
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Default Re: Fairbanks Morse, 1.5 horse, throttle governored rebuild.

I think a full seat insert could be cut in and lock-n-stitched in place.
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Old 02-03-2019, 04:34:04 PM
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OTTO-Sawyer OTTO-Sawyer is offline
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Default Re: Fairbanks Morse, 1.5 horse, throttle governored rebuild.

Depending on how badly pitted the valve seat is and where the pitting is located on it I'd try grinding it lightly to make the pits more visible and then see if you can change the angle of the grind on it to get it to clean up on one side or the other.

They may have been a standard 45 degree angle to start with but there's really no reason why you couldn't change it to 30 or 60 degrees (or anywhere in between) as long as you grind the valve to match.

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Old 02-03-2019, 07:50:04 PM
davebrode davebrode is offline
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Default Re: Fairbanks Morse, 1.5 horse, throttle governored rebuild.

Gents,
I'll have a closer look at the head tomorrow and report.
Thanks to all.
Dave
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Old 02-03-2019, 11:57:53 PM
Skip Landis Skip Landis is offline
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Default Re: Fairbanks Morse, 1.5 horse, throttle governored rebuild.

They only made that engine for about 6 months in 1919
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Old 02-04-2019, 12:40:34 AM
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Default Re: Fairbanks Morse, 1.5 horse, throttle governored rebuild.

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Originally Posted by Skip Landis View Post
They only made that engine for about 6 months in 1919
Skip is right. These engines were referred to as “1919 pattern” engines in original literature.

Here’s a video of mine running on diesel fuel.

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Old 02-04-2019, 06:06:15 PM
davebrode davebrode is offline
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Default Re: Fairbanks Morse, 1.5 horse, throttle governed rebuild

Thanks, Gents,

I've seen the reference to 1919 pattern. [I've read here for many hours].

Junkologist, thanks for the video, I have several, but I somehow missed finding yours. It looks like yours is revved up higher than the others that I have seen!

I think that I can cut a new intake seat by sinking the seat 1/8" or so. The valves are rusted to a razor sharp edge too! I've seen new valves out there. Not to mention the section under the [missing] brass tag is freeze busted out. I meant to take pictures of the head today….

Still haven't been able to get the rotating contactor loose. Not sure how those shafts come out, anyone give me advice there? I haven't fooled with the mag yet.

Thanks again.
Dave
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