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Carburetors, Mixers, Fuel Pumps and fuel delivery Discussion about misc. carbs, mixers, fuel pumps, injectors.

Carburetors, Mixers, Fuel Pumps and fuel delivery

Zenith 13417 for Wisconsin S14D


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  #1  
Old 12-28-2018, 02:16:02 PM
valley7 valley7 is offline
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Default Zenith 13417 for Wisconsin S14D

Hey guys,

Looking for some input here. I have a Wisconsin S14D with an Zenith L95C / 13417 carb.

Long story short: I rebuilt the top half of the engine because it had water sitting in it. Now it runs great at idle, but the high speed fuel circuit is not functioning. I can do various things with the choke and needle valves to get it to run a full speed but it isn't working properly.

I took the carb back off and the air pocket surrounding the main discharge nozzle is quite thoroughly plugged, presumably with oxidation related to the water.

I attached a picture from the service manual. The area highlighted in red is the air cavity which is plugged. In blue is the discharge nozzle itself.

After some brief searching, I don't think I"m getting a replacement body for this carb, so I'm looking for the most effective way to clean this out without damaging it.

Does anyone know if the discharge nozzle is removable? It looks like it is pressed in. A #25 drillbit fits inside perfectly, so I'm tempted to tap it with a #10-24 and try pulling it out. Is this a bad idea?

Thanks in advance...
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  #2  
Old 12-28-2018, 03:53:48 PM
mmcdonald mmcdonald is offline
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Default Re: Zenith 13417 for Wisconsin S14D

You can BUT with a few BUTTS. A lot of those press in type nozzles are very close to a #10 (0.190") OD after the bottom flange(and the bottom flange usually isn't that thick). They made several varieties of nozzles in that 1408 series. Some screw in, some press in, and the seat for the long adjusting needle is sometimes the bottom of the nozzle. So if the bottom of the nozzle is the seat and you enlarge that so the needle won't seat you may have a problem. Best to look it over sufficiently as far as what effect your tapping will have after you get the nozzle out. If your is indeed press in it should have an alignment slot across the bottom flange. Pay attention to its orientation when re-installing. If you do decide to tap it I wouldn't go deep, maybe one or two threads. After that you may be almost cutting the nozzle in two with the tap. Hope this helps.
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Old 12-28-2018, 08:13:42 PM
valley7 valley7 is offline
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Default Re: Zenith 13417 for Wisconsin S14D

That's very helpful. I found the slot you are referring to on the bottom.

My main fuel jet is built into the float bowl nut (it's adjustable), so I don't have to worry about the surface.

My discharge nozzle has 4 air holes in it and I was able to poke one of them clear. The engine seems to run OK now, so I'm weighing the risk of trying to pull this out and clean it up proper or leave it as-is.

Are there any other accepted practices for removing these? I've never pulled one out before so I'm quite nervous.
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Old 12-28-2018, 10:34:56 PM
eddie bedwell eddie bedwell is offline
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Default Re: Zenith 13417 for Wisconsin S14D

Hi Team,
at The Cat Dealer I worked at we had a decent sized Ultra Sonic cleaner bath that we used to clean carbon blocked passages in diesel fuel injector nozzles, turbo charger centre housings and the like.
If you could find someone with one of these units I would give it try before risking irreparable damage to your jets etc. It may do the job or at least remove some crud that may just assist in removal with less risk to damage--may need to be in the bath a few days and re-orientated from time to time for best results
Also we used to suspend items in about the centre of the bath water on wire to get best results as we felt if the item was on the floor of the bath it damaged the item and the vibratory plate.

Your results may vary.
Cheer,
Eddie B.
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Old 12-30-2018, 08:05:46 PM
Daric J Daric J is offline
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Default Re: Zenith 13417 for Wisconsin S14D

I just played with a 12160 from an onan. There was general grubbyness. Boiling the castings in water and washing soda worked really well, and seemed to help free things up.
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Old 12-31-2018, 12:27:08 PM
mmcdonald mmcdonald is offline
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Default Re: Zenith 13417 for Wisconsin S14D

Quote:
Originally Posted by valley7 View Post
That's very helpful. I found the slot you are referring to on the bottom.

My main fuel jet is built into the float bowl nut (it's adjustable), so I don't have to worry about the surface.

My discharge nozzle has 4 air holes in it and I was able to poke one of them clear. The engine seems to run OK now, so I'm weighing the risk of trying to pull this out and clean it up proper or leave it as-is.

Are there any other accepted practices for removing these? I've never pulled one out before so I'm quite nervous.
If you have a pressed in nozzle with orientation marks the top is probably cut at an angle so there's no good way to get it out without pulling from bottom.
Most of the time it's not a good idea to push on the top of nozzles anyway as it can lead to "mushrooming" and even if it breaks loose the enlarged area will prevent removal. As far as removal, it all depends on how stuck the nozzle is in the casting. If the carb is not corroded and it's just fuel residue etc. that you're dealing with it might come out without a lot of trouble. If you haven't soaked it really good I would definitely recommend that first to loosen any residue that might be "gluing" it in. If it's got a good bit of corrosion that will make it more difficult. Putting a thread or two in the bottom of the nozzle and trying it will not hurt as long as you don't pull the flange off. I can't speak for how much force you can apply without damage. I know how much by feel over 30 years but have never measured it with a torque gauge. Do not try to turn it or run anything tapered in the bottom as that will not work and could even make it harder to get out. I would have no qualms about pulling(or trying to pull) the nozzle but that confidence is from knowing what I can do without damage from years of experience. It will come out but it may be easy or it may take some time. I don't know your level of experience and am sorry I can't be more precise on the amount of force. I hope this helps a little. Good luck.
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Old 01-01-2019, 08:28:32 PM
valley7 valley7 is offline
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Default Re: Zenith 13417 for Wisconsin S14D

Hey guys,

I soaked it for several hours in an ultrasonic cleaner with lemon juice concentrate and I seem to have airflow thru most of the holes now. I'm just waiting for a gasket kit that I ordered and we'll see how it works!

Thanks for all the info!

Stephen
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