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B M Root 36" wheel bandsaw questions


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  #1  
Old 07-18-2016, 10:32:47 AM
Pete Spaco Pete Spaco is offline
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Default B M Root 36" wheel bandsaw questions

I have a B M Root 36" wheel bandsaw. It's probably from the 1920's. I got it at least 25 years ago and never got it set up. The previous owner had dismantled it to get it out of the building and I never even put it back together. Until now. It is a flat belt drive machine that has been converted to electric motor drive. But the PO made a 3 stage reduction system that has the blade running at about 440 SFM. Right now it has a 1 1/4" wide blade on it.

How fast should it go?

Right now it has a 1/2 hp motor on it.
How much horsepower should it have?

The final drive is from a 4" diameter vee pulley to the 15 1/2" diameter flat belt pulley. But the belt slips on the LARGE pulley when I load the saw down with a fast feed.
Have any of you had a similar situation?
My current plan is to change the small final drive pulley to a 2 sheave type.
We often do that with old blacksmith trip hammers and it works pretty well.

I just put brand new tires on it. That was quite a job.
Do I really have to crown the tires? I have tried 3 different blades on it so far, two of the 1 1/4" width and one that is only 1/2" wide and they all track very well.

I also hand sharpened (with files) one of the 1 1/4" 3/4" pitch blades. That's 302 teeth for this 227" long blade. I don't think I will do that again.

My main use for this saw will be to do resawing to make thin boards.

Pete Stanaitis
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  #2  
Old 07-18-2016, 01:32:27 PM
Bill Hazzard Bill Hazzard is offline
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Default Re: B M Root 36" wheel bandsaw questions

Are you saying that the saw is running about 47 rpm? That is what the rpm would be for a 36" wheel at 440 FPM. Band saws should run 3000 FPM for wood which would be about 320 rpm for the wheels. I think you would need 1 HP for resawing.
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Old 07-18-2016, 09:33:51 PM
Pete Spaco Pete Spaco is offline
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Default Re: B M Root 36" wheel bandsaw questions

Yes, that's right. Actually about 44 rpm for the wheels, which are running so slow that I can count turns.
And I do have a 1 hp motor that will go on it soon. I was thinking that it may need a lot more than that, but we will see.
By going from the 1740 half hp motor with a 5" drive pulley to my 3450 1 hp motor with a 3" drive pulley, and by eliminating one level of reduction, I can get to about 2000 SFM. I was just wondering if maybe saws that large with blades that wide should still go that fast.

Pete Stanaitis
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Old 07-18-2016, 09:50:36 PM
gootsch gootsch is offline
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Default Re: B M Root 36" wheel bandsaw questions

My 1947 BS-2 Delta 14 inch band saw came out of a plastics factory. The blade runs at about 900 fpm. A bit slow for wood but it works well for aluminum and copper. It had a 1/2 hp motor on it when I got it but it was not enough power when resawing thick wood. I put a 1 hp totally enclosed fan cooled electric motor on it and it does everything that I ask of it as long as the blade is sharp. I sharpen the blades in place with a variable speed Dremel tool with a stone for sharpening chainsaws. The 1 hp electric motors are what come on Delta 14's standard from the factory these days.
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Old 07-18-2016, 09:59:46 PM
s100 s100 is offline
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Default Re: B M Root 36" wheel bandsaw questions

There's a lot of contention around the proper speed for resawing, but something in the 2000 - 4000 fpm is going to be about right. You can vary the pulley ratios to see what works best for you. Direct drive bandsaws in that size use motors that are nominally 600 or 900 rpm, so you will have a cutting speed that is quite a bit slower than those. My 20" band saw has a 1HP motor and it is a dog unless it's got a brand new blade and the depth of cut is minimal, e.g. less than 6" or so. I have another saw, 26" also with a 900 rpm direct drive motor and it's 3HP. It's a whole new world. If it were me and I were setting up a 36" saw, I would shoot for 5HP. I'm a loud proponent of using the smallest motor that will do the job, quite the opposite of most machine owners, but the bandsaw and the table saw are two notable exceptions, where more really IS more.

As to the tires, don't mess with success! If the blades are tracking well, count your blessings and leave it alone.

Arguably the most important single element for success in resawing is a good blade, By all means tinker with the blade you have, but when you get to cutting some wood you really care about by all means invest in the best resaw blade you can find, maybe even a carbide-tipped blade. You won't believe the difference in cut quality and ease. And yes, carbide blades do use more power than carbon steel blades, so make sure you are sufficiently powered.
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Old 08-02-2016, 05:24:08 PM
Pete Spaco Pete Spaco is offline
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Default Re: B M Root 36" wheel bandsaw FYI on progress----

Thanks for the input, guys.

I did put a 1 hp 3450 rpm motor on the saw, still using the existing jack shafts. But with a 6" pulley on the drive motor I am up to a little over 1000 SFM. I also installed a brand new "wood slicer" blade that is, I think, 3 tpi. The 1 hp motor does drive the saw well. I was a little surprised since there is a certain amount of system friction with the old babbit bearings.
And---- I did add the second sheave and belt to the final drive. I am using lead weights, about 60 pounds worth, to tension the final drive.
So far, no slippage when resawing dry hard maple boards up to about 6" high.

Now I am doing fine tuning. I am using a shop made resaw fence that is about 10" high as a guide. Now I am dealing with the issue of whether or not to adjust the line of cut for blade drift. Some guys say you have to do that, some say you don't. I am going to go the the NO Drift adjustment approach, for now at least.

I suppose it's easy to sit back and laugh at this newby, but it sure is a learning experience.

I have made 2 videos of the saw so far, but neither of them is good enough to let out into the public eye. Maybe #3?

Pete Stanaitis
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---------- Post added at 04:24:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:22:05 PM ----------

Oh, the cuts I have made so far look almost like they came off the planer. And, of course, NO burning like they had come of my table saw.

Pete Stanaitis
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Old 08-02-2016, 06:15:43 PM
DustyBar DustyBar is offline
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Default Re: B M Root 36" wheel bandsaw FYI on progress----

Many don't use a fence when resawing they just use a narrow guide set close to the blade. It allows them to easily compensate for the drift which may change with wood grain and hardness. I don't use a fence on my 14" bandsaw.
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Old 08-04-2016, 10:03:26 AM
Pete Spaco Pete Spaco is offline
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Default Re: B M Root 36" wheel bandsaw questions

I have heard of the guide option, but I wanted to get the saw working so there is NO drift to have to deal with. The guy on the American Woodshop says that if everything is right and you have a good blade, there should be no drift.
I am getting pretty close.

Pete Stanaitis
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  #9  
Old 08-10-2016, 06:39:08 PM
Pete Spaco Pete Spaco is offline
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Default Re: B M Root 36" wheel bandsaw questions

Here's the link to a video showing the saw as it is right now:

https://youtu.be/eB4G7TR2ZS8

Pete Stanaitis
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Old 10-14-2016, 10:22:16 AM
Pete Spaco Pete Spaco is offline
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Default Re: B M Root 36" wheel bandsaw questions

Well, it's running at about 2000 SFM now, with a 2 HP 1725 rpm drive motor. I eliminated one of the jack shafts to get to this speed.
If you saw the video in my previous post, you saw my rip fence. It seemed to work pretty well, but sometimes I'd have a "strange" drift problem about half way through a cut. Well, yesterday it finally hit me as to why that was happening.
If you look at the way I have the rip fence located, it runs all the way from the front of the table to almost all the way to the back edge.
Okay. But, often, when resawing a piece, the wood bows as stresses are relieved as the cut progresses. If the wood bows away from the cut, toward the fence, which it usually does, that forces the yet-to-be-cut wood away from the fence, giving the effect of drift.I usually try to correct this with additional hand pressure since my featherboard isn't very high, but I am not always effective or quick enough.
So I have just repositioned the fence so it only extends about a half inch past the back edge of the blade. This should allow any bowing to occur without affecting the rest of the board.

I haven't tried this new configuration yet, but I think that'll solve my last problem.

The saw is working quite well at 2000 SFM, so I don't think I will increase the speed to 3000 SFM anytime soon.

Pete Stanaitis
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