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Antique Gas Engine Discussion

Looking for info on a Stover's engine. Please help.


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  #21  
Old 04-12-2005, 09:34:21 PM
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Jason Heffner Jason Heffner is offline
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Default Re: Looking for info on a Stover's engine. Please help.

For now I think I am just going to get the engine running again. Once the engine is good running comdition I will begin the restoration. I was able to confirm that the engine does not have the original paint on it so I won't de-virginizing it. Monitary value is of no concern to me. My grandfather has had this engine since before I was around. He spent a lot of time getting this engine running and looking good. I want to make sure tat I give it the same treatment. Hopefully after going through the fuel pump tomorrow I will have the engine running. After the workout I got trying to start it tonight, I need a good night's sleep. Thanks.
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Old 04-12-2005, 10:04:01 PM
Dick Welty Dick Welty is offline
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Default Re: Need help getting my engine started.

Jason,

Once I had trouble with a check ball sticking. It seems that the ball went too far into the seat. I found a stainless steel ball bearing that was a little larger than the original ball. I then seated the ball by tapping on it with a drift punch. The ball was very hard so the drift didn't dent it but it did drive the ball into the brass seat enough to make a good seat. I then had a stainless check ball which has worked fine ever since.

If you try this be carefull not to drive it too hard. The seat can also be dressed up with a drill bit by just turning it with your fingers. Frontwards first then backwards. If you did that and then tapped the original ball with something like an oak dowel or something softer than the check ball you might also achieve a good seat.

Good luck. Dick
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  #23  
Old 04-12-2005, 10:06:09 PM
Neale Behm Neale Behm is offline
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Default Re: Need help getting my engine started.

Jason,

I'm gonna play Mr Obvious here and ask if you're not blaming check valves that are working correctly. Are the fuel lines hooked up correctly???

I've made mistakes like this more times than I care to admit. All part of the fun though.

Thanks Harry!
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  #24  
Old 04-12-2005, 10:49:45 PM
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Jason Heffner Jason Heffner is offline
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Default Re: Need help getting my engine started.

I'm sure that they are getting stuck. The pump works fine for a while but once it stops pumping you can take the pump apart and turn it upside down and the check balls are stuck. I'll try to clean the pump up tomorrow and hopefully everything will be good. Thanks.
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  #25  
Old 04-13-2005, 12:56:13 AM
Andrew Mackey Andrew Mackey is offline
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Exclamation Re: Need help getting my engine started.

How old is your fuel? Gas can turn into panther pis- in as little as a week in an unsealed container . if the fuel is old, or if the engine has been sitting a while, the checkballs and the valve seats can become coated with varnish. You get the engine running, by freeing up the check balls, but then you let the engine sit a while, and the balls are stuck again, says to me that you are gummed up. Drain the fuel tank. put in 3/4 tank fresh gas, and a can of carb, or injecter cleaner, to clean the tank. Buy a can of Berkbile 2+2 carb cleaner, and spray the fuel pump interior, and the check balls, and dry thoroughly. Take care with the 2+2! , it will remove paint just as fast as the gum in the pump. If you blow dry the pump, wear saftey glasses, as this stuff will do nasty things to your eyes, if you are not careful! Once you have the engine runnung, let it run for an hour, running as rich as it will tolerate, without fouling. After the hour is up, lean the engine out, burn off the carbon, and have a good day . The injecter cleaner should remove the gunk in the tank. There are 2 ways you should store an engine, for a length of time. One: fill the tank full to the top, run the engine once a week, for at least 15 minutes, shut down, and refill tank. This will A) keep the fuel in the tank fresh [if the tank is topped off, it leaves little area for evaporation, and helps prevent condensation from forming in the tank], B) warm the engine and dry off condensation, C) keep fresh fuel in the fuel lines and pump, D) circulates oil and grease, to keep bearing surfaces and piston free of gum and rust, E) allows you to enjoy your winter a little more! Two: drain the tank thoroughly, and run the engine until it quits for lack of fuel, open fuel pump, and dry out thoroughly, put oil in the pump, on the check balls, and thoroughly lube all lubrication points. Open the oiler, and let oil run into the upper con rod bearing, and thoroughly soak the piston with oil. Pull the engine over, and pull partially against the compression stroke foe a few seconds. This will :A) prevent the pump from gumming up, B) will ready the engine for winter or long term storage, C) seals the combustion chamber against rust on the valve seats, piston, cylender, and rings.
Andrew
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Old 04-13-2005, 09:21:38 AM
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Jason Heffner Jason Heffner is offline
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Default Re: Need help getting my engine started.

I looked closely at the seats for the check balls with a bore scope this morning and it does look like there is a bit of gummed up fuel on them. The tank was empty when I started, likely because what was there had evaporated and I filled it up with fresh gas but there is still a hint of stale gas smell.
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  #27  
Old 04-13-2005, 09:57:34 AM
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Elden DuRand Elden DuRand is offline
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Default Re: Need help getting my engine started.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Heffner
I looked closely at the seats for the check balls with a bore scope this morning and it does look like there is a bit of gummed up fuel on them. The tank was empty when I started, likely because what was there had evaporated and I filled it up with fresh gas but there is still a hint of stale gas smell.
You probably have a tank with a lot of dried varnish flakes in it left over from the old gas that evaporated away.

First thing I'd do would be to pour-in a dollop of Gumout and fill the tank to overflowing.

Then, when you get the engine running, let it run for a half hour or so the first time. This should dissolve -most- of the varnish but expect more of it to appear once in a while.

When it reappears, just repeat the Gumout dose. Eventually, all the varnish will be gone, just leaving the rust, dirt, old nails and mouse droppings.....

Take care - Elden
http://home.cybertron.com/~edurand
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  #28  
Old 04-13-2005, 11:04:42 AM
Kevin O. Pulver Kevin O. Pulver is offline
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Default Re: Need help getting my engine started.

Jason, I've read here that denatured alcohol is the thing to eat up varnish. If your tank is as dirty as it sounds, I would remove it and give it a thorough cleaning before you try to run it. It might be easier than fighting with it.
And yes, if your check valve is sticking it will hit when you crank it because it sucks the fuel up; but when it starts to coast after firing, the fuel runs back down and when it tries to hit again there is nothing there. If you had it under load and it was hitting every time you might not notice the sticky check.
Kevin
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Old 04-13-2005, 12:36:35 PM
Bob Johnson Bob Johnson is offline
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Wink Re: Need help getting my engine started.

Jason: I would use either denatured alchol or laquer thinner and put about 1/2 gall in your tank and use the rest to soak all the fuel lines check valves and such to remove the old varnish. I would get a ball the same size as that one you want to seat and use JB weld to attach it to a piece of 1/4 " dowel. When it is dry put some valve grinding compound on the ball and usea drill motor to drive the device to grind the seat in the check valve. I think this is better than pounding on the ball. This should give you a good seat.
Hope all comes out well.

Bob Out west on the high desert
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  #30  
Old 04-13-2005, 02:07:06 PM
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Jason Heffner Jason Heffner is offline
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Default Re: Need help getting my engine started.

This morning i disassembled the fuel pump, cleaned and inspected all of the parts. I picked up a steel ball bearing that was the same size as the brass check ball and welded it to a 5/16" automotive pushrod. I then used some valve grinding compound to lap the ball into the housing. The check balls were a little dirty so I just cleaned them up with a piece of fine Scoth Brite. I then cleaned the housing and reassembled the pump. I put some wheel bearing grease on the packing around the fuel pump pushrod so that it would move freely. The fuel pump is ready to go bak on But I want to make sure that I am getting new clean fuel into the pump before I try to start it again. I'll let you know how it goes. Thanks.
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  #31  
Old 04-13-2005, 08:04:11 PM
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Default It Runs!

Well, I got home from work this evening and went straight to the garage. I installed my freshly overhauled fuel pump, a spark plug from another engine, some fresh gas and started turning the flywheels. I knew right away that it was going to start tonight just by the sounds that it was making. After a few tries it blew out a puff of smoke and just like that, it was alive. Just to hear the sound of it again was an incredible feeling. When it finally got up to speed and the governor hung the exhaust valve open, the sound of the engine freewheeling made me feel like I was ten years old.

It only ran for about a minute before I could hear it begin to slow down. The choke was all the way open right from the start so I don't know what I should have done to keep it running but I'm sure it'll come around. Does anyone know which direction the governor lever is supposed to go to increase or decrease engine speed.

Thanks to everyone that provided all of the useful information that lead to bringing this engine to life. More to come.
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  #32  
Old 04-13-2005, 11:10:50 PM
Kevin O. Pulver Kevin O. Pulver is offline
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Default Re: It Runs!

Way to go Jason. I don't know which way to adjust your governor, just remember "Springs GIVE fuel, Weights TAKE IT AWAY." Look your governor over and you'll figure it out. Kevin
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Old 04-13-2005, 11:20:20 PM
John Cunningham John Cunningham is offline
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Default Re: It Runs!

Well Jason I think you have got it about right. That joy of the first few puffs of smoke and off they take. Last weekend I started an air cooled Cunningham Engine after it had been sleeping for over 40 years. I bet I watched it run for over a half hour. Not sure what you have there but to increase engine speed you need to increase the spring tension against the govenor weights. Which way does the lever move to increase this spring tension? I guess I am a little tired did you say what engine. May make a difference if the weights are on the flywheel or on a seperate govenor shaft but the principle is the same.
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  #34  
Old 04-14-2005, 09:28:38 AM
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Default Re: It Runs!

The engine is a 1913 Stover model W. I'll figure the governor out tonight. After it quit running I pulled the plug out and it looked as if it were running rich. The spark plug looks like it is a cold heat range. I'm going to see if I can get a hotter spark plug. That may make it less sensitive to carb adjustment for now. I'm just trying to figure out why it quit running after a short while of running. It did the same thing about 10 years ago when I got it running. I'm thinking that maybe the ignition coil could be the problem there.
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Old 04-14-2005, 09:48:50 PM
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Default Re: It Runs!

Good Job Jason !! It sure is a nice feeling to get one running.
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