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Small Air Cooled Gasoline Engines Briggs & Stratton, Clinton, Lauson, Maytag, Nelson, Wisconsin and other small air cooled engines. Sub forums for mowers, scooters and powered eqipment.

Small Air Cooled Gasoline Engines

No Spark Continental AU85


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  #1  
Old 04-10-2009, 10:50:29 PM
Jim Cobb Jim Cobb is offline
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Question No Spark Continental AU85

HELP
I put rings a new rod , bearings and seals in my engine and replaced the plug wire .
now that I have it together I have no spark , the engine was running and the spark was ok but the plug wire was the type with graphite string and put in in 1960 .
This engine has the contex type ignition with out the governor which has the points located on the top out side of the block and has no indicator on the cam lob rooter to set it .


No. 1. Even if the engine is out of time would you still get fire . I installed the cam shaft with the timing marks lined up and set the point cam lob on top at the open position and tightened it down .

No. 2 . I have the small coil wire on the right side of the coil going to the same side of the points as the condenser , should this conection have any continunity to ground ? it seams to have a small reading .

No. 3 . How can I check the coil and condenser ? even though It was running And I feel I hooked up something wrong I don't see them going bad in the parts box .

Thanks ,
Jim
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  #2  
Old 04-11-2009, 12:12:18 AM
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John Newman Jr. John Newman Jr. is offline
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Default Re: No Spark Continental AU85

First off - You have a very unique magneto with lighting coils included on it! This engine must have been used on a scooter of some sort that had lights.
I have been studying your pictures and have a few questions. It looks like there are 2 wires connected to the condenser. Is this true? Where does the wire go that is threaded through the black rubber grommet? The wire that is part of the condenser should connect to the points (it looks like this is done right). This same connection should also have the wire from the coil (Ignition coil[3] - Not the lighting coils[1&2]) connected to it. A wire could also be hooked up here for a kill switch. When (if) grounded, it shorts out the ignition - Killing the engine, so you do not want it touching anything if you want spark.
Cam timing can be checked without too much trouble. If the head is off, turn the engine through in the normal running direction and watch the valves. The exhaust valve will start to open as the piston starts to come up in the cylinder. As the piston gets close to the top, the exhaust valve will start to close. Once the piston passes TDC and starts back down, the intake valve will start to open. Now go back to where the piston is at TDC between the exhaust & intake stroke. Both valves should: (A) be closed, or (B) be barely open the same amount. Some engine cams are timed with a slight amount of overlap, some aren't.
When the high spot on the points cam passes the rubbing block on the points, the contacts should be open (separated) .020". The contacts should be touching each other at all other times.
Let me know if this helps. I agree - Parts usually don't go bad sitting in a box.
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  #3  
Old 04-11-2009, 08:42:27 PM
Jim Cobb Jim Cobb is offline
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Question Re: No Spark Continental AU85

Thanks John ,
I have gone over everything and still no spark .
I think I may have gotten the coil over heated when I took the flywheel off it didn't come off easy and I used heat on it .
Do you think small engine shops can check the coil and condenser ?
I would gladly buy new ones if I could find them , The book I have gives a condenser with .16-.20 cap. what ever that is and the No. on the coil is X11180 the magneto plate is marked part No. WF 2580 I wander if the two ending with 80 is a coincidence or if that is how they match them up .

I am getting a coutinunity reading from the small pole on the coil to the magneto plate and when I conect it to the points that causes the breaker arm to be grounded when the points are open .
Thanks for your help and let me know if you have access to any parts .
Jim
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Old 04-11-2009, 10:25:54 PM
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Butch Yowell Butch Yowell is offline
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Default Re: No Spark Continental AU85

Jim, the points and condenser are Ford 6 cyl 144 engine, the black coil is the ignition coil, 1 and 2 are the lights.


Butch
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Old 04-15-2009, 01:52:19 PM
Dempster Dempster is offline
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Default Re: No Spark Continental AU85

Jim,
Wico FW-2580 was called a Wico ElectroMag meaning it had lighting coils as well as igniton. You can't hook the lighting coils into the ignition system or will fry the ignition coil. You said it was firing before and it looks to me someone has mounted different points and condenser those are not Wico OEM for it so probably have timing off if coil is good yet. Still didn't find my parts list for that mag what points and condenser it used but I'll keep looking. On your X11180 coil test the secondary maximum resistance between the points wire and spark plug terminal wire output it shouldn't be over 7000 ohms. The maximum primary from points wire and ground wire or bracket shouldn't be over 1.0 ohm. Do those test with wires and condenser disconnected to get correct readings. Only other test is a firing load test has to be done on a coil tester. Those secondary and primary test specs came from the Graham Lee coil & condenser test manual for Wico X11180 coil. I still have to look yet if I have that coil and if we had a parts sheet for your mag or could find one with Wico points and condenser numbers I might have those too.
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Old 04-15-2009, 03:40:29 PM
Jim Cobb Jim Cobb is offline
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Default Re: No Spark Continental AU85

Thanks Dimster ,
I put on a new set of points and condensor from a 144 CI 6 cyl. Ford falcon and on spark .
My neighbor tells me I could put a external coil in and install a battery to fire the engine how would that be done ?
I would rather find a new coil I am sure that is the problem I don't see any thing that can be wrong except the coil .
Thanks ,
Jim
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Old 04-15-2009, 10:45:41 PM
Dempster Dempster is offline
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Default Re: No Spark Continental AU85

Jim, Did it not originally have points you think? Still didn't find a illustration or much on parts break down for it in my Wico books but one chart said a breaker plate kit was not applicable to it so I'm wondering if it was one of Wico's early ones that used an electronic trigger type unit but still had that type of coil. Oh did find I had one NOS coil yet in old box. The coil passed primary and secondary tests but it fails the firing load test miserably so it's not any good or going to help you. Sure is a tiny coil not sure if I have any others close to the same size or not but can look at some of the others. Yes, you could mount a external battery coil on it too. If had another magneto coil could use an electronic Omega box also.
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Old 04-17-2009, 09:14:27 AM
Jim Cobb Jim Cobb is offline
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Default Re: No Spark Continental AU85

Hi All ,

Standard Magneto is sending me a new coil , I will keep you informed as to how things go .
Jim
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Old 04-20-2009, 05:50:03 PM
Jim Cobb Jim Cobb is offline
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Smile Re: No Spark Continental AU85

Hello All ,
I receved the new coil from Standard Mag . and I now have a running engine . I think the heat used to remove the flywheel was what the problem was .
Thanks All .
Jim
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Old 04-21-2009, 12:45:53 AM
Dempster Dempster is offline
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Default Re: No Spark Continental AU85

Glad they still had it. Found out a X11260 coil is same size but primary wire out a different place and I had one of those but it tested no good either so mine were all junk so getting my bins cleaned out lol.
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