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Allis-Chalmers Model E - Modified?

Old Scrambler

Registered
Hello All.........My brother and I just reclaimed our Father's Model E tractor from the 30-year owner that bought the tractor at the farm auction near Adell, Wisconsin. It sat outdoors for a few years and then was stored in a shed where it collected a large amount of dirt and was subjected to several leaning objects that caused the radiator to become 'racked'. Our family acquired the tractor in 1947 from another farmer who was getting out of the contract threshing business. The steel wheels were converted to rubber in about 1949. We used the tractor for several years to power the 28-inch McCormick thresher and a Case blower for chopped hay and silage. I parked 'BIG CHARLIE' in 1968 and that was the last time he had been running.

Based on the numerous photos of other E models, we believe the fenders may have been replaced and we know the fan shroud was removed. We have the IHC magneto that was on him since 1947. The engine has #15228 on the left side and the water-jacket plates have casting numbers of AM-1844. The brass plackard on the dash has #21208. We could not find the other numbers to be located on the 2-speed tranny case, near the shifter cover, or below the seat as some reports are aluded to.

The sheet metal is in rough shape and will need to be replaced. Our Father modified the draw-bar. The plugs came loose and the steering and wheels turn. The motor is stuck with a small amount of moisture rust showing on one plug. The water pump is also stuck and the water-bath aircleaner is cracked. My brother is taking Big Charlie to Atlanta, Georgia to try and restore him.

The BIG question is: What type of motor is this? It has 8 pushrods going to an L or overhead valve head with an aluminum valve cover. The mag, governer, and water pump are on the left. The intake, exhaust and carburetor are on the right. I hope the attached photos will help. Thanks to all for any advice on the motor and how to get it loose.
 

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FWurth

One Millionth Post
Last Subscription Date
07/29/2019
Wow! I can hardly believe what I see. That aint no E. If I'm not mistaken that apears to be a 15/25 Allis with the Midwest engine. These came out in the early 1921 period ,didnt sell well and were droped shortly after in favor of the larger model E. These are quite rare and highly sought after. The down side is parts are almost non existing. We always wanted to add one to the stable but never came across one . You are very fourtunate indeed. Frank
 

Engine Whisperer

Defective Email Address
Last Subscription Date
01/14/2016
Yeah, Frank is probably right on, I didn't know for sure what it is but it's not a model E. Nice tractor.
 

Kent McMakin

Subscriber
Last Subscription Date
09/05/2019
Boy, what a deal. If your brother does take it south to restore, I hope he does it up right. That is a very scarce and desirable tractor. Fortunately, there is plenty of AC knowledge out there to help you out. Got any pics of the whole tractor?
 

Paul Roidt

Subscriber
Last Subscription Date
07/17/2019
Congrats, The tractor you have is a 15-25 Model L. It appears to be in pretty good shape.

It must feel good to get it back after so many years, were you looking for it?

From your pictures you have many hard to find parts, like the air washer, manifolds, carb, and aluminum valve cover.

I am restoring a 20-35 longfender the big brother to your tractor. I am building a complete new radiator, however I think it is bigger than yours.

The serial number is the one on the dash, according to Swinford's book your tractor is a 1925

Paul
 
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Richard Sturdy

Guest
Your tractor is certainly not an E. I suspect that it is the smaller (and much rarer) model L 15-25. I have never seen one "in the flesh" as it were and you have a wonderful find there!

Tricky Dickie
 

David Parfitt

Registered
Age
46
Richard, there is one in the UK that has recently been restored by a well-known A-C enthusiast. Hopefully we will see it out and about soon.

All the best

David
 

Old Scrambler

Registered
Thanks to all for the info.............We always knew where Big Charlie was stored and had been to see him a few years ago. I wanted to restore him but have no heavy equipment or garage space. I work on motorcycles and sometimes don't leave enough room to park my wife's car. When my brother retired I tried to get him interested. He went to a tractor show and started to look around on the Internet. Because the tractor is green, everyone told us it was a Model E. When Roger saw the interest at the tractor shows, he called me for the contact info with the owner. I saw the owner at a funeral and told him of our interest. He said if we wanted Charlie to come and get him. Roger paid him a small amount to compensate for the $50 auction price he paid in 1979.

The sheet metal is rough and the radiator frame is wraked. The tools are still in the box and the mag turns. We always kept Charlie well greased and oiled. There is no water in the pan and the oil is dark but smooth after 40 years. Everything on the carburetor looks good. The lower elbow on the exhaust is broken from ice. The air-intake stack is whole because it was removed and laying under cover. We will start doing the research on the L models. Here are a few pictures with accumulated dirt. Dennis Weinhold in Wisconsin
 

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Paul Roidt

Subscriber
Last Subscription Date
07/17/2019
Dennis,

Thanks for the pictures.

I chased out to North Dakota after 15-25 once, but came up short. Now one shows up with in a hundred miles! Congrats again for getting it back in the family.

Here are some pictures of the radiator sides I have made.

If you measure yours maybe they are close enough to work with some modification.

Paul
 

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Richard Sturdy

Guest
Richard, there is one in the UK that has recently been restored by a well-known A-C enthusiast. Hopefully we will see it out and about soon.

All the best

David
Hey David, Can you persuade the owner to bring it to the YVA Show at Newby Hall on 6/7 June?

Tricky Dickie
 

Old Scrambler

Registered
So...........now we know a bit more information about the 15-25 Model L. Steel wheels and the Dixie 46C magneto appear to be the only missing parts to return Big Charlie to original. Here are two more photos. I hope to post a photo or two of when we were working Big Charlie on our farm.
 

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Brasherman

Subscriber
Last Subscription Date
07/12/2019
A great save with some great family history and RARE. Would this be the same mag you are looking for? I have been watching it on my ebay list:

Dixie Mag

It isn't complete, but it would be a start if so.

Good luck,
Corey
 

Phil Johnson

Sponsor
Last Subscription Date
07/12/2019
One of the sponsors of this site, Adrian's Magneto service may be able to supply you with the correct mag. I have dealt with him several times and have always received excellent service. He has a huge stock of mags.
 

Old Scrambler

Registered
Thank you, Paul, Corey, and Phil for the suggestions. We are taking notes and developing a plan. At the same time we are gathering the few photos of life on our farm in Sheboygan County from brothers and sisters. Our grandfather was a contract thresher and traveled to Missouri, Kansas, Nebraska, and western Iowa in the very early 1900s. He assembled a crew and loaded his separator on a rail-car in Adell, Wisconsin. When they returned home, they threshed oats in the Town of Sherman. Our father bought the farm and began updating the machinery in the '30s. He continued to thresh oats on local farms until the late 1950s. Big Charlie was able to run the 28-inch separator with two wagons and four bundle pitchers. Unfortunately, I was the youngest son so that meant I had to shovel a lot of grain in a hurry!

We had an early WC and then a newer model with the electric start and lights. We added a WD which reduced Big Charlie to belt-work only. I learned that when Charlie was running his best on a hot summer day the carburetor would have frost on it and you had to let him idle for a few minutes before you shut him off. I also learned that you pull up on the crank, never push down. Although I grew to be the tallest in the family, I couldn't start Charlie until I was about 15 or 16. He was the slowest tractor around but never stalled on a hill with a load or when pulling the separator. One of the hills near us required another tractor to help on the way down to provide enough braking. We always had a big crew helping to thresh on our farm. I think it was because of my mother's strawberry-torte! I don't remember getting help in the grannery until my sisters were older.
 

Paul Roidt

Subscriber
Last Subscription Date
07/17/2019
Dennis,

Keep the stories and pictures coming, I really enjoy them and am sure others do also.

Paul
 

Old Scrambler

Registered
Paul.....Jim Feider Sr. has an original Model E parked in his shed at the edge of Plymouth, Wisconsin, behind his Town & Country Auto-body shop. I don't know what size it is, but it sure is big. The radiator crown has the Allis-Chalmers casting. Here is a pic or two...........
 

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Paul Roidt

Subscriber
Last Subscription Date
07/17/2019
Dennis,

Another very nice tractor. Probably a 1928 or 29, 20-35, looks like it has two ribs on the fenders. The 1927's only had one rib.

I have meet a John Feider, he has a 20-35 long fender. Do you know if they are related?

Paul
 

Old Scrambler

Registered
Paul. I don't know the whole Feider family. Jim has a lot of siblings from the Random Lake area. He has a collection of 164 or more tractors. He is restoring a Plymouth right now and has a few very odd tractors, including a Minnie Cross Engine.

Big Charlie arrived safely in Achworth, Georgia. A good rain storm has turned him mostly green again. Roger has gotten the clutch and transmission working, and has freed-up the governor. He plans to get the sheet-metal replaced and have the rims / wheels ready for new rubber tires by Fall. The Gadston, Alabama show is in October and he would like to show Big Charlie at the former Allis plant grounds. Time will tell if he gets him running. Here is a pic of the dash plackard with the serial number.
 

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